stilton

Maybe my post was too long for attention span of the average forum user..Lets try these key points in bold. Back in 2015 i mentioned the way the game handles 'movement' and the constant communication between client / server. The game essentially moves your character about.. You can 'feel' this whilst playing the game. Sometimes you feel like you are 'fighting' your own character, or you get rubber banded about. Is everyone happy with this? Because there doesn't seem to be much impedance for the devs to fix something if they think its fine.. and if nobody says it's a problem they will think its fine. Finally, playing in their office with the servers the 'issue' would not be as obvious than someone playing remotely. So, to really further simplify, and for lack of better descriptors, the question is: " Do you see any problem with the way the Movement in this game 'feels' ? " or better: " Are you happy the way the Movement in this game is handled? " Personally i would say it's currently not a good enough implementation for a 'competitive shooter'. I shouldn't be fighting the zombies, players, user interface, ladders and 'central hive' - only 2 of those. ------------------------------------------------------ This is the start of the post before editing :) Mainly to do with the fact i can't even turn consistantly after reinstalling. But since there's not a huge number of people confirming the problem i'll assume this is something particular with my setup that will not get fixed. :) I re-installed yesterday to see what progress was being made and wow... I've got a few beefs, i'd appreciate some enlightenment: 1) Simply put, i move my mouse 1inch to the left... my character rotates for example, 180 degrees... If i rotate the same amount to the right.... my character rotates 720 degrees, so... 3 times more. Only in the game. This is the first thing i noticed within about 5 minutes and tbh i didn't really play too much after that because it was just frustrating as fuck, because i couldn't fix it in the controls, within the pages upon pages of user interface. So, giving the game the benefit of the doubt... ( even though i couldn't do simple things like, disable other controllers from the built in user interface, which you could do in arma2 afair. ) What could be causing this? or is this a known bug. I'm going to go and double check / delete all config folders to double check its not some old config file interfering in my Docs/dayz. 2) Is increasing the FOV via the config allowed / accessible? or is that considered 'cheating' ...It's just i played the game (or used to) in 3840 * 1920 resolution with headtracking... So, the fov is kind of 'zoomed in' and sickening. 3) I'll also assume since i'm guessing alpha is coming to an end soon and you seem to be focusing more on client/renderer implementation now: - Is the current implementation of the client / server what you're going to be sticking with then? : Where turning itself is a laggy experience? It's a shame, because it's really bad.. honestly. Some things about this game you can forgive because 'oh its based on arma 2' but not even arma2 'feels' this bad when you play it... I'm not trying to shit on the devs here for the sake of it.. But you've improved arma 2 in a lot of ways, at the same time you've also made the gameplay experience much much worse in others... All these UI improvements are for naught if playing the game is motion-sickness inducing because of some constant rubber-banding like experience due to the server continually repositioning you or whatever the fuck is going on. Again, not trying to shit on your work just for the sake of it.. But you can't really blame arma 2 for that because compared, arma 2 vanilla 64 player warfare gameplay is smoother.. and when you hit someone there, they die.. overall their game feels more consistant, competitive and rewarding... Here i can't even turn consistantly anymore. If i were you guys, and i had programmers to spare i would spend as much time as possible further refining that client server talk, so its either better interpolated, or it checks more frequently; because right now,` personally, i can still 'feel it' and i'm still fighting my character.. and i played it for like 2 minutes earlier.. and if you can't do that, because it costs too much (bandwidth or whatever) then get rid of it... But i doubt you'll do that because a games company realising they've fucked up and actually fixing something is like a unicorn.

I'm not trying to sound edgy or anything, but if replying to these topics is such a burden to you people... Maybe you shouldn't bother? I mean what do you think you're adding to this other than giving people a low opinion of yourselves / the community and an overwhelming 'smell' of virgin angst? Just disperse the information you claim to have... Or do something productive with your time, that doesn't involve replying in a cunty manner. You impress nobody talking down to them. (See, i'm doing a fine example here, i bet you love me right?) Big shout out to the one person flying in the face of convention, with an eyebrow raising name: "Gews" Holy shit.. 6000 posts and he's still recognisably a human being, not a hint of condescension in his posts. Gews.. How have you maintained your human features / ability to communicate rationally with others in an adult manner despite the fact you've got over 6000 posts and you've clearly spent a lot of time battling with the 'people' who inhabit the dayz forums? *Pushes mic into gews face* Anyway. This topic has served its purpose because someone actually condensed the information they had and served it to me. I now know this game is steering away from 'good gameplay' in the service of 'wealism', according to this: WEALISM ...if stiff controls constitutes 'realism' for you, i guess you must be wheelchair bound. Just to really nail this point home, because a lot of you still seem oblivious to it. Which is kind of sad when you consider you think you're equipped to debate but you can't understand simple concepts like canvassing for opinion -- really shows the level of intellect: "Even if an issue, has already been posted about and it's known issue... another person dogpiling on another topic about it, whilst maybe frustrating for you, for some reason?" serves a purpose in itself... It helps add weight to the problem, it shows how many people suffer this issue. Also, Maybe a lot of you don't understand english as a first language so i'll forgive your ignorance. But it's ironic in telling a person what they can / can't / should / shouldn't post on a public forum where you are not a moderator. Not in a comedic sense of irony, in the 'logical' / 'it makes no sense' / 'never have children, one of you is enough' sense.

It's just a strange situation to have something that's apparently 'not supported' essentially break the game and have no way to turn it on/off or configure it from within the game. A strange implementation indeed, surely it should be 'disabled' altogether.. If there's still any confusion: i am not frustrated / dissapointed / saddened or any of these 'emotionally' loaded words, nor am i 'complaining' -- i am providing feedback. I appreciate the leaps that have been made. Personally i was skeptical when they announced the 'new renderer' and the devs have proven my skepticism wrong and indeed succeeded in what they set out to do ...The same with the 'new inventory system'. Hopefully they are aware of the problems with player controls, where it feels like the game is taking control away from you and it's not a smooth experience. [ Rubberbanding is one of the better descriptor for the 'feeling', because it is reminiscant of playing on an old dialup modem ] But only a fool would assume so and hope for the best. At least i can personally say.. I voiced the problems several times, on one occasion (2015) i was assured by a dev it was something they were looking into... But until the problem is fixed, there's nothing gained by sitting back and not voicing the problem. I understand if you've read thread's like this before, i invite you to not reply and do something productive with your time... Because you add nothing of value to this conversation. You could say the same about what i'm posting.. I would counter that i am another user/customer adding weight to the value of a particular concern. Finally, as an 'excuse' for my post, this is posted on my time schedule, not theirs.. I'm sorry if they've done a poll that asked peoples opinions over the last 6 months what the userbases' opinions were on rubber-banding caused by the nature of their client/server implementation -- but like I've said before, i'm not getting paid to hang around and partake on their schedule. (So, there's no grey area as to where i'm coming from -- I'm certainly not trying to come across as cunty here, but apparently some people think it's wrong of me to post any feedback, or apparently i'm supposed to go do 'research' before voicing my opinion - No. Nobody has to read my opinion, take it on board, or even care.. But unless you're an employee of BI or a moderator i'll kindly invite you to take your unsolicited opinion of me / my posts and apply it to yourself. )

Yes, the controller was interfering but there's no way in the ingame UI to enable or disable it? How is that function not being there anyone else's responsibility but the devs? I understand alpha, but having to unplug a controller that is not even turned on before running the game is poor implementation, for a project of this scope, even in alpha.. Thanks for giving me permission to post on your forums i appreciate it.. But, "Who are you?" - wasn't a serious question.. It's purpose was purely rhetorical to highlight your stance as 'self appointed defender of the devs'. You seem to think you are shaming me? by puffing out your chest on these public forums whose purpose is for players to give feedback. That's all i'm doing, i reinstalled the game.. and these are immediate things i noticed that (as far as i can see, at first glance) haven't been altered in 2 years now... Basic pillars of a first person shooters design, character control. Basic things that have actually got worse, i'm just posting as another voice saying 'this is not right and needs to be fixed before release' Just so you're clear on who you are: I don't need your permission or approval to post my opinions, so you can continue to do whatever it is you think you're doing, for whoever's benefit it is intended.

Sorry to take away from your "valuable time" with my topic that obviously demanded your attention.. Who are you again? Also, thanks for taking the bait. Unplugging the controller and deleting config files did fix that issue... I had only assumed since: - the controller wasn't enabled when the game started - it wasn't usable inside the game + there was no indication that it was interfering with the game. - there was no ability to enable/disable it within the game (this is the devs responsibility, if you're gonna make it work ingame.. make it provide player feedback and have the ability to configure enable/disable it.) Finally... That fixes that -one minor issue- that was Not the main gist of the post... The main point of my post was criticism regarding the 'feel' that has been present since they implemented their 'central hive' architecture. see reference to post made back in 2015. dueuhr Sorry didn't realise i had to have at least 1000 posts or get 'special permission' from the 'in crowd' to give feedback these days... I'm SO SICK OF THESE POSTS *stamps feet like a child*

Yes thanks for mentioning that... I forgot to say (although my post was long enough) fov maxed (it only goes to 80 in my settings) and zooming out the view gave it a more 'natural' feeling that wasn't nauseating.. But the fov should be increased imo; I shouldn't have to zoom out the view ingame to get a view that is 'playable' imo.

So, i don't presume to know -exactly- whats happening... But at a guess i'd say the game is constantly tracking your position, and updating the 'hive' or central database with it, also contacting that to get information on local spawns... etc. The problem i 'feel' when playing is it happens so frequently and when there is some discrepancy you... actually getting teleported about a few feet or whatever... Or, you rotate slightly but the server 'resets' you to where you were looking a minute ago... Or you're searching a house and suddenly you get moved back to the room you were checking a few minutes ago. Whilst i understand in some areas the game has to take away the players control in order to enforce some sort of delay for balancing: - switching items - reloading - blah But is this going to be fixed? or is this 'the system' now and it's basically finished? I'd love to hear an official response on this tbh.... ...Because as i understand it this 'new system' is bespoke for SA, and as much as i can see why the devs might feel it necessary to have it controlled like an MMO, you really should try playing outside of a LAN environment because the constant teleporting combined with the 'arma engine' controls of driving-a-soldier ( opposed to the 'feel' of say, counterstrike or Bf4 ) i mean it's not only frustrating to play constantly teleporting about but it breaks immersion and i imagine it would get you killed a lot ingame... I just hope they are still working on it and there is going to be a -massive- improvement on the delay between client and server otherwise they've basically fucked themselves by shoehorning in this MMO type architecture which clearly makes the game unplayable. (for me anyway) And i guess i'd love to hear from anyone who doesn't experience this lol...

cool, i'm sure you guys are on the ball :) Again though, to be certain we're speaking of the same thing, i went with LAN because obviously the delay between announcing your position and receiving acknowledgement/validation from the server would be much less pronounced in a LAN environment due to the almost non-existent delay you would experience due to the obviously much shorter distance to the server(s). [game server and database server] Comparing that to someone connecting remotely, the 'feel' of being constantly moved-about a few feet every few minutes or so really detracts from feeling like you are in control... Also, i can't fathom why it's being implemented this way at all... I understand there should be some sort of validation with the central hive concerning player movement/position being logged for the purpose of tracking cheats and what-not... ...But i don't see why my position should keep getting constantly overwritten by some remote value, especially with such delay and error... Surely its enough to just log people doing things they can't possibly do, then flag them, then delay-ban them... ? I'm sure there's some benefit in the chosen implementation... I just hope this is not the solution to 'cheaters' for example, that actually ends up making the core-gameplay much worse feeling. I mean, people complained about arma controls 'feeling' sluggish since it's release in vanilla.. -- But in Arma2, i never had to worry about 'am i standing where my client is showing me standing' for example, except maybe in rare instances of extreme desync. And even then... You and the world were still represented quite well, just instances of other players on your client were off.. then when you re-sync'd, everything went back to normal... I would hope trying to improve things to negate the already sluggish controls would be a high priority instead of introducing things that infact make it worse. [ I'm not talking about optimizing, im talking about the core 'gameplay' -- character controls / feedback ]. TLDR: I should never have to question/guesstimate my own position in a game where positioning is such an important tactical consideration. Example: I run out into a courtyard to take cover behind a vehicle during a firefight, to have the game go... 'Whoops, you're not actually behind the car in cover, you're 5ft behind that in the middle of the courtyard in the open' In that instance, how am i supposed to know, where EXACTLY i am standing, and what my opponent is seeing, all this stuff is fundamental.

Cool, i only raised the issue because it might not be as transparent in a LAN environment, which i assume is where a lot of the in-house playtesting gets done... It's not so much a 'game breaking issue' for me, but its just one of those things that makes the game 'feel' bad. and it used to be much more noticeable on 'laggy' servers... It was also not present in the mod and it seems to me, to be very much a product of client-server architecture. Also, since the loot spawns have been turned down (off completely?), and there are no zombies that I've noticed... That in itself would surely contribute to there being less 'positional lag' -- So I'd be interested to see whether there is still this 'big improvement' when the loot and zombies and vehicles are all turned back on in full force... ...Because basic player movement should really be quite a high priority when playing a first person shooter [captain obvious much?] .... It certainly shouldn't be nauseating trying to move about the world, the server should never 'take control' of my character and move it around without my input. I hope I'm being clear enough, since it worries me when this is described as a 'connection issue'

Try reading comprehension, it's a little hard to 'play more than 5 minutes' when you CTD with no error messages literally every 15-30 seconds... ;) Thankfully (since i immediately posted the issue on the bugtracker *pats self on back* ) the issue has been acknowledged, so when it's fixed.. I will resume playing.

Cool.. loaded up experimental, made a new character... loaded in, got teleported about a few feet... thought hmpf... started running to cherno... CTD with no error message. massive improvement. xD

Are you actually alluding to something ontopic or just trolling? :) Because no, i haven't played experimental in about a week or so... Or really looked at these forums in a few weeks

Yes?

Yes?

This is the current patch notes... Im praying to god, that what is being suggested here is just a 'placeholder name' for a system of Perma-death/respawn timer... and has nothing to do with the seperation of 3rd-person-only servers. (really should be called, perma death or respawn timer in the news feed surely?) Because if i have to play this game in 3rd-person-mode to stay competitive with all the people hiding behind walls/bushes/rooftop lips... i'm done :) Not trying to come across as 'whiney', but i'm just saying... It's going a bit too far into the realms of arcade-game for me...

I hope not... Sorry i don't hang around here much, pardon? ..Then i re-read the original topic and noticed the topic title change... *whoosh is the sound of that going over my head* It's been a while but they used to be in the server list as Normal/Hardcore? Now it's 1st/3rd person but if you filter for the word 'Hardcore' you will find mostly 1st-person-only servers. [ just as proof it's not a personal thing to me, or something from my imagination, people understand hardcore to be synonymous with '1st person only'. ] What could possibly make me think... The fact they're both called 'hardcore' ? -- That phrase goes back to the days of the mod in terms of server filtering. Surely as a mod you've played the game a bit and you're aware of this, no? I do specifically say that i realise it's possibly: I was merely concerned they were changing 1st/3rd person and doing something with that. Regardless of my error, it's a bit daft to name some 'new' option/system, the same name as a current/old option, especially if it has nothing to do with it. It's a little confusing? Perhaps just to me. And even then, i understand that it's probably a reference to the battlenet system where you get 'Hardcore' mode. Personally though i would have thought it would be better to use the much more standard* term 'Ironman Mode' but now i'm merely quibbling semantics... ..Which does seem relevant considering the purpose of this whole post, was really to get clarification that it is infact that usage of the word 'hardcore' and nothing to do with 1st/3rd person... I guess it goes to show you people can misunderstand if you use confusing language. ...the very definition of semantics. *standard in my opinion, i've seen many games use the term Ironman mode to define perma-death. So then my question/point would be... Do you think the name is appropriate? (given it used to mean something else in dayz) And/or Do you think any of these are more appropriate: Hardcore ModeIronman / Ironman ModeBestiality Mode... Send your answers on a postcard to Blue Peter name that gamemode challenge, P.O Box.... lol

You are wrong. This has been a 'feature' of the RV engine for a long time.. Perhaps it's no longer a 'feature' of dayz... But most people who have played Arma/ Arma2 / Arma2:OA for years have known about this 'feature' for years. That's why you can see an increase in performance by turning Shadows / Clouds or Particles* (i believe particles too) to High, if you are currently suffering from a CPU bottleneck. This can easily be tested at very low resolutions, with other settings isolated to see the effect, as people have tried to tell you. Perhaps it is you who needs to go and educate themselves on what you think you are an authority on... Because not only are you wrong, you are insulting people who know more than you. Also throwing out 'OH AND IM A PROGRAMMER' really makes you look like you're actually a fisherman or something (no offence to fisherman). Because any real programmer would admit that being a database programmer for example.. doesn't give you inherent knowledge of all games, and all their intricacies.

I switch to experimental and get the error: Error compiling pixel shader PSNonTLHeatHaze:0 after the dayz 'splash screen' shows for a second... In a very small window, to which i click 'Ok' ...Then obviously the game doesn't load. This doesn't seem to be mentioned anywhere here on the forums or bugtracker... Just wondering if anyone else has come across this? All i did was.. switch to experimental via steam beta tab, removed the customer launch parameters i had put in.. Then doubleclicked on dayz. I've also tried reinstalling dayz but it doesnt seem to fix it... ...Anyone else come across this / know of a fix / care to help? :)

Wow... issue resolved lol. I had renamed Dayz.exe to Arma3.exe a few versions back, to force Dayz to use the arma3 SLI profile. ...For some reason, steam was choosing the run that arma3.exe instead of the Dayz_experimental.exe So i caused it basically, and it's 'fixed' ...Still not sure why it was running that exe though...

i did try deleting the whole 'dayz' folder out of there in the hope it would rebuild it, but it didnt make a difference...

you should download Nvidia inspector... Not only will it allow you to see what (if any) SLI profile/settings are being used... It will allow you to add the dayz.exe to the arma2:oa or Arma3 profile and it forces SLI to use that profile's SLI settings (which is especially useful if you're using older drivers (pre dayz SLI profile)) which seems quite apt considering dayz is built on Arma2... Also the older drivers [332.21] seem much more stable and optimized for SLI on my system.

If you can read the title and understand.. You may yet have a chance to enjoy your game experience... ...I see a guy posting a thread about 'working for others' that guy has the right idea, chronicling his missions trading with players to give them free pristine loot.... That guy will enjoy himself regardless of getting killed -- playing the game for the enjoyment of the experience. ...Groups of players hiding in buildings trying to snipe people to take their gear... ..To get better gear, to make it easier to hunt players... Who rage so hard when their shit gets taken. These tears are delicious to me. The game is about survival and death... At the moment its mainly about death because survival is too easy [at the moment, the mod is harder] If you're coming to dayz to outnumber and 'win' against smaller groups/ single players you will lose eventually, even if you think you are some pro MVP sniper -- and i am glad you are losing your shit with nerdrage when your group of scrub cripples get wiped... Retards hiring out private servers to 'loot up' and go deathmatching on populated servers are just as bad... ...I'm not saying my way is the only correct way to play the game, but i get enjoyment regardless of my deaths ingame, regardless of whether i'm teleported to the coast by a hacker and put into the thunderdone, regardless of whether i'm killed by a ladder or a door [meh, thats alpha] but if you're playing dayz to play squad-deathmatch you missed the point... There are better versions of TDM that would cause you less virgin angst when someone kills you and takes your precious ballistic helmet or whatever... In truth -- this is not meant as a 'troll thread' really... Well, it is a little... ...It's meant more as an education for new guys. :D

tldr? I'm not criticising KOS you illiterates: I'm laughing at the people posting threads whining about it. The duplicity and the rage combined is like delicious food with some sort of delicious sauce on top. Doubly delicious and probably fattening? No examples? http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/179966-hacker-on-de1-10-noclip-death-in-berezino/?hl=hack#entry1851957 Guy looking through walls, with 3rd person, KOS'ing in a group, All of them hiding in a building ... His scrub group gets wiped, Rage posts on forums. Triple delicious... That is what motivated this thread you deficients.

So many ' i rage hard, therefore this post must be motivated by rage ' Delicous. Sadly very much off the mark ;o) I haven't played the game in a about month or two or three, so there goes the assumption i just got KOS'd and am here to 'rage'. :) (SA's fun but i saw most of the content pretty quickly and i've done my fair share of DM on SA and spent many an hour sniping groups of bitches on the mod ) If i wanted to play i'd probably be playing that [the mod] because it has the features that i personally enjoy... [the hunting, the working persistance ... the zombies. ] The player 'interaction' (funny way to word 'killing' ) is just extra flavor for me... So many off the mark: I'm not judging KOS'ing... I do nothing but KOS, but as a defense mechanism... Everyone gets a short warning, Some gunfire: Then im off in the other direction. I dont go out of my way to hunt people. That was fun, for the first few weeks i played the mod, but it's actually too easy [pro gamer alert] when you're running 5 man deep with delta squad and all hiding overwatching cherno. I'm just someone who finds the entire 'lets rob people' or 'lets go hunting noobs in cherno' trite, it was fresh when this was a mod, now it's not even amusing or gratifying to me. I'm happy to provide my CV as proof to all your wanna-be-private-dicks... So you can confirm im not *gasp* lying on the internets. Just let me get them out of my time machine. Good effort though, replying to a post and trying to gleam the intentions of a poster who isn't really pushing any agenda other than just general cynical bitching at the majority of a hundredthousand community for the sake of it... Maybe, i dunno, to waste time? Projecting much? To clarify, since the thing tying most of the critical replies together seem to be an apparent low-IQ or poor reading comprehension: If you want to do anything i've negatively described... It's your time to waste, but obviously (incase you missed the title) you can never 'win' this game ...Now go clean the shit out of your undies: And don't use your toothbrush this time.

This thread is a microcosm of: " the drawbacks of open-alpha / Carl Pilkington on Economics"