ZooBeastman

Well about an hours play in to first person only server Zombies.NU - SE2. I'm not too fond of the view at the moment, I find stairs and tight corridors irritating, losing any perspective on my characters footing and actually physical presence in the world (I suspect time adjusts this), the graphics look worse being up close to some slightly dodgy textures. Sneaking around wherever I started was fun enough; no really different to third person though (I'm probably not the most careful player though..); I certainly didn't find the experience in anyway more immersive but that is probably quite situational; I've had no fire fights yet. I have found I get a lot more tearing along with the camera feeling a little seasick inducing, mayhaps I'll get use to that and I suppose I could force vertical sync for the tearing. Head bob plus low blood visibility is very disturbing :p . Though I think climbing a ladder was overall the most odd experience so far. Someone earlier asked why the same size of either this forums poll or the reddit poll wouldn't be indicative of the actual distribution of player preferences, assuming the what 1.8mil uniques your going to need what? 2300 responses to hit a 95% confidence level? That's also ignoring any other factors that drive players to reddit or these forums; there's a reason 'we' are more invested then most.

Might be a little OT but... Can someone point me in the direction of a good first person only server? I know 'good' is pretty damn subjective but given the passion of some of the 'remove the third person cam completely crowd' which I genuinely believe think it to be better for the game, I'm going to try and get a couple of weeks in just first person under my belt. I will say though, even if by some unexpected change in how I enjoy the game in third versus first, I think it highly unlikely I would rather everyone joined me. I find it slightly unfortunate how many first person only advocates play on third person servers and thus create the chicken and egg, not enough players thus not enough player scenario. I've always in life felt that the "be the change you want to see in the world" is the way to live. Quite frankly if the numbers of first person advocates is in anyway reflective of how people feel at large, its for you guys to make those servers successful enough to attract others. I don't think torpedoing the people who don't agree is the most productive way, -edit especially those with any kind of following, be them streamers or youtubers or whatever

I would be in favour of trying this, but I have a feeling while playing it would feel quite er... shitty and look very strange / glitchy (even if not glitchy)

I was pondering the whole 'path of least resistance' argument and am curious to how much flex there is in it. For me it raises the question "If its easier to use third person perspective and by assumption this means more people use third person perspectives why do people not just play 'less resistive' games?" There must be another factor and I'm stumped that it could be anything other than subjective fun.

DayZ is literally a game that includes third person.. it is literally what is being described. Re-spawning detracts from authenticity; does it belong in a sim? Its a game, its made for entertainment purposes. There is no new argument being presented in what you responded to. Very early in the topic I suggested it is largely a "some people actually like playing from a third person perspective". I've yet to see a single comment suggesting the third person camera isn't operating as a third person camera. It is literally the opposite of broken. I think the camera could be improved without making the game first person. I don't think that there's a great deal of benefit to such for people who just want to play the first person experience. First person servers solve this much better than any restriction. In the poll thread there are comments that suggest people who only want to play first person exploit (as in utilise) the third person camera to see things they can't in first. People actually arguing that the people who simply enjoy playing from a third person perspective are exploiting it in some way beyound those who perfer using the first person but switch to third only to exploit it's benefits. (again utilise). If third person was merely liked by people because it works as a 'wallhack' then removing it will mean however many people who use it by default will use proper wallhacks.....of course.. this makes so much sense. I think expanding segregation to character creation level makes a lot of sense. It may even encourage people who play on third person servers who would rather not to not do so.

The thing is, no third person player would be making this argument. I completely understand that people who want an 'real' perspective of the world, where they can not have information their character could not whilst in first person. The thing is, if you enjoy playing third person games it simply ins't your primary concern. No more so then if you use outside systems to converse with you team mates you will have information your character couldn't. I'd much rather people didn't use skype / teamspeak etc, because It would be great to hear other teams talking in game, I don't however think that it would make the game overall more enjoyable for a lot of people. The fact the guy in the second screen can see me doesn't bother me at all, its just part of the game. Various components of a game add up to hopefully something fun. Some systems add fun and detract in another way and this what making games is all about balancing the feel of the game you want to go for against the entertainment value you believe your delivering. Any argument that third person players have abilities inherit in a third person camera is merely pointing out the obvious. I don't believe anyone is suggesting 3rd person is more authentic; just lots of people seem to find it fun; that there's more to gaming that being 100% authentic. I appreciate that a poll has been made but I am reasonably suspect to if this forum constitutes an average set of 'Dayz' players. That said, looking at PlayWithSix I'm not sure I want to use the top servers as an example. Does anyone know of a FPS only, loads of guns, vehicles and all that jazz server? I suspect though both un-modded and modded have greater popularity in third person; even if this is not the case on the sample of forum users.

Curious, other than direct responses to some slightly off remarks I see my posts as quite heavily resolving around the original post's suggestion to discuss third and first person views? If my posts are off-topic, may a mod errr mod me.

No you didn't in fact you made a number of mistakes during your edit.The first while without a source is likely true; think is not the correct word however; "as IMHO" is incredibly poor phraseology.. "We" which you have replaced with I refers to various posts throughout people have said they don't like things about third person, I would be suppressed (based on this thread alone) if I was the only person who has issues with third person games. "they might also be" - eh? No they simple are. "I think that..." is superfluous based on the use of probably,. "which is not a fact but purely my personal opinion" is a very odd caveat to add at the end of a paragraph about balance. Chess wouldn't be balanced if someone had different pieces no matter how close they are. It also comes across as exceedingly obnoxious. Boggled again, can you have an inpersonal opinion? Where did you learn this stuff? The concept of an objective opinion.. I will dream of this.

The thing is, DayZ is at least currently a third person shooter; the majority of people play it as a third person shooter I cannot think of another way of describing it. Simply because we don't like elements of third person shooters does not mean they are inherently weaker games; they are merely different games. There's been several suggestions, particularly before the discussion on what an exploit or cheating actually is/entails on potential improvements to the third person experience; and I'm all for it; its how I play, making it as good as possible makes the game I play better. I don't really see any great possibility of ever making them 'equal' however and I'm not even sure its a worthy goal. If you're competitive enough to care that other people have an advantage over you because of the camera type they use then you probably won't be happy without a fully even playing field. The only way to achieve that is total separation. I don't really understand why the vanity argument is considered a bad one; if someone gets a kick out of looting stuff and seeing their character develop then I can only see that as an advantage over not. I personally feel the main advantages of third person are both the empathy (attachment to) and interaction with the world you can see/feel in the character in front of you. I don't want to see the poor chap eaten. Anyway time for me to sleep, enough peaking 'round corners for one night.

I'm sure that means something to you. I'm glad in my professional life I never come up against such intellectual arguments.

How about the current server selection? Surely this is literally the best option in terms of balance?

I'm not sure what you think I am ignoring?

How about ArmA ?

I'm not sure comparing a game with full esp and aimbots everywhere to every third person shooter ever made is sensible. I also assumed this thread was not only about people who only like first person expressing there views. I have made several suggestions that could improve the situation for first person only players. I'm not sure there is a better one than the current division though.

It's simply how third person games play; I am not aware of any which do not allow peaking, there probably are some. I doubt when making a third person game a developer would suggest, "right people love peaking around corners and exploiting stuff, so lets make a game that works like that" rather than "people like playing games in third person... lets make a game like that". Yeah it comes with some stuff that isn't ideal.