tomfacekillahhh

yep totes with you on this. any possible solution needs to be more careful to not 'blobsnark' everything like the antibiotics patch did. your solution of more items actually makes a lot of sense to me, but i feel unless it were PERFECTLY balanced, it wouldnt work to cause anything but more griefing. picture this. 'oh fk my fever is about to make me go into convulsions, ill have to KOS the next few people in hope they have some medical supplies. god knows i wont make it to a town', this would probably start happening with just about every disease they are intorducing. it seems like so many people went crazy with 'lets have this in the game! lets have that! lots of items!' without realising it can have the opposite effect its intended to have. players will eventually have trouble finding that one rare part from an item they are crafting, and they go loco taking anyone down to get it.

I feel like now your just being a little pedantic because its how this community seems to act when a new concept is introduced. sure, bandits and kosers have a place in the game. but it shouldnt be gamebreaking to the extent it can be today in the dayz community. i completely agree with making items harder to keep, the fact is, the suggestions i put into place tho are all in line with how dayz currently is, and dont ask for anything unrealistic. the mechanics im attemtpting to explain dont force anyone to change their playstyle or mentality at all. they arent forcing a change to anyones mentality. they are giving people bases and anyone who wants to utilise them can. bases are something that has been confirmed too. so if its a mechanic that will eventually be implemented anyway, it definetly, at the very least, needs to improved upon A LOT from the current tent system. i just want to make this clear, you are sorta saying you dont care that the amount of bandit KOSers shot through the roof when a huge amount of children got bored of cod, and that it changed dayz for ever. when did you start playing the mod? cos i can tell you, long gone are the days of making a group of random survivors, banding together from elektro to do a vybor raid, and then painting the airfield red. these days youll either get sniped instantly in elektro, some child in your group gets bored running north and starts just onloading on your group with no reguard for even themselves... your also sayin, if base building offered even the most basic of storage abilities, players would be forced to do something. No ones forcing people to play as a bandit or not, and no ones forcing them to live alone, with or without any stored supplies. if bandits and kosers dont want to take advantage of this system, thats no problem. they just dont get the added benefit of having a storage space. so in summary, a base building / storage option, whether advanced or even the most basic of approaches would cause players to want to change their own playstyles to take advantage of these features, regardless of if you aim it to change the communities playstyle, or not. edit: a feature already exists, and has for a long time, that forces players to group up, or not be able to sieze certain game opportunites / items. blood bags and epi pens. so, do you disagree with the mod in this regard to? was it too much hassle having to follow a realistic idea of not being able to give yourself an adrenaline shot while your passed out? were you upset when you couldnt blood bag yourself, and wish that feature wasnt in the game, because it forces players to work together?

cool, cheers for your posts man, from what im hearing, the general consensus is that the game should be harder to force people to work together. This sounds good, but could also entice just as many people into killing to get items because looting it is even more trouble to go to than ever. And with the current player base of dayzmod being so hostile, they will still likely be just as agressive in SA. You know what this will else this will also cause? the exact same gripes a slew of people had with the lack of antibiotics in a recent patch, but on a MUCH MUCH larger scale. survivors, heroes and bandits, groups and loners, all will perish far far too quickly by a constant pvp battleground and a lack of tools to circumvent the causes of death. im starting to think players are completely ignorant to the fact bases are planned features. When they are finally implemented, what will be the point if the same problems arise as in the mod? same goes for vehicles in storage, if they can eventually be stored. whats the point of going to the trouble of using the base build feature if its just as easy to spot / break into / destroy as in the mod? and something i cant get an answer too, is why players can rationalise their characters being taken out of the game world when they are logged out, but not any storage devices / vehicles they own or anything. i love finding a broken down old UAZ at zelenogorsk, and remembering its spot. me and my comrades make it our new mission to loot industrial sites for repairs. it gives the game an 'end game' feel, or at least a sense of purpose for a while. basically anything but adding weapons just gives us more stuff to do, which prolongs the time until the 14year olds get bored and start shooting everything they see. i am all for added vehicle maintenence requirements, air pumps for tires, extra tires, transmission and break fluids, oil change etc. but this alone wont change the current dayz player base into a community that promotes teamplay, even amongst bandits. i played dayz for the first few months as a lone survivor, and if i still were, i would have no problem with running into groups of bandits or heroes who had established a safe base and community for themselves. people would probably slowly rebuild and make settlements... edit: people also dont stop existing all around the same time for 12 hours. yes theres sleep, and some people would try and rationalise this downtime by saying its like being asleep. but when you sleep, you can wake up. when you disappear from logging out, you are actually at work slaving away to survive irl, and dont get a chance to defend your base or items.

someone just bought this up and it made me think about something for a bit. Do you believe players in-game characters should be safe when logged out? why or why not? why is this different to gear, like say if u log out in a car, why wasnt that car ever saved to your character and not the map? id say it came down to engine design limitations, and id even go so far as to say if vehicles were able to be logged out with their character, it would of been implemented from the beginning. Like cars need keys to run. Why can you only lock cars in like 1 unnoficial mod? or tents. Im sure they only persist after death due to design limitations. The true dayz gamer feels dirty going to an old tent to rearm, cos it defies the logic of your survivor being a brand new character. Id say tents were only even persistent after death due to further design limitations, eg multiple people having stored items in a shared tent.

see this is a bit of a grey area for me and for most players - where do our players go when we are logged out, and why can they be completely safe from being looted, while other things we collect must stay vulnerable? im suggesting bases that are un enterable for the time being, so they still work like tents, except for disappearing when the owner logs out. They serve as placeholders until the enterable underground dayz bases are implemented. so as long as im online, you can steal all my crap, if u can find it! and as long as you're online, if i can find your tent, its as good as mine :D

thats true. but you feel safe 100% of the time you are logged out... bases are eventually going to be implemented somewhere down the track, just whats the point if they are as vulnerable as tents? itll be another huge waste of time, a broken mechanic thats utilized most for farming to exploit loot mechanics. this way, bases are at least attempting to bring players together, by offering balanced incentives, if they choose to do so ofc.

ooh k now i get you thanks for clearing that up. I couldnt stand cookie cutter crap in MMOs. i completely agree here, but bases are a system that need to be implemented eventually. The current tent system is very flawed though. so say the bases didnt give any exponential increase for groups sharing access, they were only visible in game when u were logged in, and that they were completely destroyed upon death. Would it still be forcing players to take one path, when realistically, if you wanted to make your base a certain size, youd need 2 people at least to do the job? That just seems like logic to me, and i dont get the cookie cutter feeling, but that might just be cos im biased a little towards my own idea. I dont think it is forcing players to take a path though either, its just a better option to take that path. Players can lone wolf with a small stash all they want.

k this might of been my bad but ima edit the original post just beneach the tldr, and change forum title if thats possible =/. instead of me trying to explain,could you explain how would the system i thought of prevents anyone from playing however they want to?

hahahha input noted. this isnt me crying cos dayz is too hard tho. When the game got more popular, and the going got tough, and when the kill on sight mentality of most players i came across seemed to occur more and more often i made a choice. Instead of going rogue or ever complaining or anything like that, i just went and got people less experience with the realistic elements of a computer game like dayz. The extra challenge of keeping them alive, as well as teaching them along the way, still is a lot of fun in the mod. Bandits will always be present, you will always eventually be killed, and i like that in this game. But i think what draws people to this game, and the zombie genre, is seeing how people change, and react to the broken world they are stuck in. In real life, which again,is what dayz is trying to replicate in a lot of ways, people arent as willing to kill another human usually because of the thought of what if it were us. Theres a bunch of other reasons, but the fact is this is programmed into most humans for our survival as a species. Theres no way to replicate this value of an in game character as accurately, but the base building idea iv suggested is a good fair solution to most playstyles, except for loners, who couldnt really construct as large a structure realistically anway. Any legitimate suggestions to offer tho?

was this direceted at my post? cos i completely agree buddy, trying to change the playstyle of people is the wrong step for a game like dayz. But the numbers i threw up werent statistics, nor were they changing to change anybodies playstyle. This is about the psychological effect of having the ability to store items safely, and a system that does so WITHOUT forcing anyone to change playstyles, but instead promotes their own play style. I guess the title wasnt well enough thought out. This post is more aimed towards promoting teamplay and coordination, than ending killing on sight. Its just either way, a side effect of a good base building mechanic will be that it will encourage this type of social play. And like it or not, steps ARE being taken already in standalone development to try and get players to play together more instead of just KOSing. Now this is just my opinion, but i think most people would agree here, strength in numbers, majority rules, that whole thing applies here in a few regards. In a game with base construction, how is a loner going to be able to construct an underground bunker singlehandedly? Shouldn't more players in a group have the ability to lift heavier beams, and be able to make bigger storage spaces?

well, when i started playing dayz, it was all one giant world, not hives. You were usually at the same spot when you logged in and it was to my understanding thats how dayz SA would be. Another flaw i left out was one you just bought up, but if your stash always spawns into the server after you log on, and you always spawn into the same spot on the map, your base is still only invis when you are offline, which fits fine with the idea of the game. This opens up the potential for server hopping for farming, but this isnt a problem that hasnt been encountered before even in the mod. Nor is it a problem that cant be dealth with by having zones around towns where stashes cant be built too close. Besides, if someone wants to take the time to farm all the mats itll take to build a base, and then build it close to somewhere thats gonna get noticed and shot up, thats their idiot choice to make. :P so this way having your base spawn in with you whenever you are logged in, keeps your base vulnerable while you arent guarding it, yet cant be used to just hide your gear on a different server.

does it seem silly to you too though that when you die currently in the mod, you can go rearm at your old tent, somehow the whereabouts of which is stored in your new characters subconscious, like some kind of instincts? i think the current tent system offers a lot of potential storage, but your gear inside of it should be wiped on death. Thats just part of it, while you're in game, everything should be vulnerable, but i think when you arent in game, it should be safe. The novel i just wrote is sorta attempting to make a balanced solution for this problem and i appreciate your input, but what can you see as the most viable short term solution that will in the long term social play, whether bandit, hero, or loner? Really, i have no qualms being outgunned and flanked by 4 coordinated attackers, its the endless waves of bored 14yo cod kids that annoy the crap out of me, hopefully a new system implemented quickly in SA would draw even them to team play.

I'm inclined to agree, but feel the overall experience would still be more enjoyable if players werent run and gunning willy nilly, and had a reason to group up and build a base. I was going to mention this as one of the flaws i saw in this whole idea of mine, but left it out to save anyones eyes bleeding from that wall of text. This base system could be temporary until locks / password security systems are implemented. So for the time being, stashes would be invis when you logout, promoting a bit friendlier of an atmosphere initially, but once stashes are able to be locked, they could potentially persist. Thanks for your feedback tho, input noted :thumbsup: