crazykage

Ok. Thanks people for continuing the discussion in a mature manner. Most seem to be against the idea, primarily because they do not want the game to, in a sense, dictate "how they feel". Which is fair and valid. But, I proposed the idea, and I have to give it its just due, and attempt to defend it (kinda playing devil's advocate, but at the same time, not entirely opposed to the idea either). So my argument for it is this: There is something to be said for "atmosphere". The first time I logged in and heard rain drizzling, I thought, "niiiiiice...". It was followed up by a flashing epic FLASH of a lightning bolt (which scared the piss out of me, as I wasn't expecting it), and the ensuing blast of thunder. I was almost instantly sucked into the moment of the game, deeply immersed from that simple, atmospheric effect (gameplay was enhanced). Of course, this was just after the update that caused the huge memory leak, so it didn't last long. Other games in the horror genre attempt to do something similar (some succeed and others don't) by projecting a specific atmosphere. Sounds of heavy breathing, increased heartbeat, dynamic character animations, combined with a visual art style designed to instill fear or paranoia (shadows, certain configuration of angles and shapes, dark colors, etc). As said, not all games are able to pull it off correctly, but when they do, they can create an experience that is rich and immersive. And this is not exclusive to horror games. So, could it not be said that certain dynamic effects, brought on by compounding events in game, would, if done right and with some subtlety, enhance the "atmospheric" sensation? As you sneak (assume zombies that don't agro thru buildings, from 500 meters away facing away from you) up on a zombie, the game code detects this, and veeeery subtly narrows your field of view (tunnel vision), plays an audio track of a steadily increasing heart rate, as you get closer and closer, then *WHACK! the zombie goes down, and the tunnel vision reverses while your heart rate slows until it is no longer audible. OR you miss, it turns and sees you, then lunges for the attack. SUDDENLY your heart rate skyrockets, you are breathing heavily (again, this is assuming more dynamic, dangerous, zombies than what we have currently), panicked and scared, now its fight or flight. EDIT: also assumes 1stPP only....

anybody got any new thoughts or opinions?

L-shaped military flashlights, anyone? They typically come with different colored lenses. Clear, blue and red.

Hmmmmmmm.... What if.... What if i could use a knife or bayonet to carve tick marks into my butstock, one for every player killed? Would love. Also, i wouldnt carve my name into it. I would carve in the name of the weapon (Mosin: Lucy. M4: Lisa. SKS: Lena. Colt: Loraine. FNx: Luan). EXCELLENT idea. Beans

Oohrah brother......oohrah.

How about a system that instills fear and other psychological effects on players that don't kill other players often enough? A player that has lived too long will have seen many horrible things. If they fail to act on these things (not killing enough bandits, not saving the lives of innocent bambis, etc), they will begin to suffer from feelings of self loathing (from failing to potentially save a life), impotence, lack of confidence, or depression from seeing so many horrors and failing totally to do anything about it. When in this state, the constant fear and lack of confidence could cause a reduction in accuracy, random moaning or crying, clumsiness (dropping items randomly), higher likely hood of becoming sick, general reduction of the health of the character (more easily wounded, take longer to heal). A "hero" character might suffer from PTSD from seeing so many people he has helped die, or turn on him after helping them. If he doesn't at some point act to defend himself, sometimes pre-emptively, he should develop feelings of paranoia and intense fear (game could FORCE his character to draw a weapon and shoot at a player nearby). Players that suffer in this state for too long could randomly fall to the ground and curl up into a fetal position. At this point, the character has taken too much abuse to its psyche, and must either commit suicide, or simply allow itself to be killed. Also, players that simply hide in the woods and never see anybody or anything, could become highly paranoid, or lonely, or even schizophrenic, and start talking to themselves at random intervals, which would alert zombies and players alike that happen to be nearby. EDIT: THIS IS A STATEMENT EMPHASISING A POINT COUCHED IN SARCASM. DO NOT TAKE IT LITERALLY. See my next post below for more.

*AHEM! Folks, I just wanted to come here to say... "TUNNEL SNAKES RULE!"

This topic makes a useful point. It wasn't made arbitrarily. It shows the argument from the opposite perspective, and shows quite clearly why the argument is flawed. It was done in the hopes that some people MIGHT understand why the idea is flawed, and hopefully be beneficial in the long run when they think to propose the idea once again, or at the very LEAST, encourage them to bring something new to the table in a logical and practical manner that is viable, balanced, and fair to all. I personally don't think it can be done. I believe whole heartedly that I can easily take any kind of argument that proposes DELIBERATE CONTROLL AND LIMITATIONS on ANY playstyle, and poke so many holes in it that it essentially becomes a spaghetti strainer.

I did not make this thread to troll, but to make a POINT. The people proposing a psychological punishment mechanic are doing so out of SELFISHNESS. They want to limit how other people play the game, so that more will play the game THEIR way. I have killed another player, that was not a direct threat to me, and unprovoked, 5 times in over 130 hours of play. I don't KoS often. In fact, I do it VERY rarely. But when I want to do, BY GOD IM GOING TO DO IT. It is a part of the game, and should not be limited. Myself and others have argued this from every angle, from every direction, in every manner possible. Everything has been covered, from implementation of future game mechanics that will offer greater incentive and options for player cooperation (thereby reducing the KoS that results from shear boredom), to the simple fact that its a sandbox game where I can do whatever I damnwell please, to the fact that KoSers bring in the element of fear and adrenaline that SO FEW games manage to ACTUALLY do. So I made this thread, to make a point. The "carebear" crowd will undoubtedly read this and hate it just as much as the KOS crowd hates their ideas. POINT. Its a poorly thought out system, that would be utter bullshit if implemented, and would completely ruin the game for a large portion of the player base. POINT. It offers no empirical data, nor does it indicate any actual method of viable implementation. POINT. It took me all of 3 minutes to think of and type out this "idea". POINT. It is EXACTLY the same kind of idea already proposed ad-infinium (albeit reversed), which has already been disproved time and again, yet is defended over and over by individuals who bring NOTHING new to the discussion. POINT. I CHALLENGE anyone to give me a logical, well thought out proposal, using facts, figures, and GENUINE ideas, on how such a system could be implemented, as well as to give me a logical reasoning as to WHY another player's behavior in game should be controlled in any way. AND to do it in a manner that is not rude, or insulting. I do not believe it can be done. EDIT: forgot one: The only thing about this idea, and the "anti kos" version, that makes sense is that IN THE REAL WORLD, these things could and would happen. But we are playing a GAME. this is RECREATION. P-O-I-N-T!

Im 28 years old. A United States Marine. I play the game in a mature manner that makes sense to me. In total, I have killed another player, that was not a perceived direct threat to me, and unprovoked, FIVE times in all 130+ hours of play. I am sick of seeing this forum flooded with the SAME idea, that is terrible and bullshit, from people who put absolutely ZERO thought into the proposal or its implementation, all because they are BUTTHURT that they lost some DIGITAL ITEMS. Meanwhile, useful discussion is pushed away. I try to explain in a reasonable fashion why these things wont work, and shouldn't be done, but the response is always exactly the same, only worded in a different way. Tell me, in a logical manner, what kind of system, why it should be implemented, how it could be implemented in a manner that is balanced, makes sense, and ACTUALLY VIABLE, as well as why other players' style of gameplay should be limited or controlled AT ALL, be it friendly carebear or mass murdering serial killer, and I GUARENTEE you I can fill your argument full of holes faster than you can imagine. Yes, THAT is a challenge. But I warn you, I will ignore with extreme prejudice anything that implies insult or rudeness. Edit: It was FIVE players, not four, that i "KoSed". My bad.

"restrain", "restrict", "incentivize", "punish", "eliminate", and every other word I can think of has been used in lieu of this subject. All of the ideas proposed force a limitation of some sort on my chosen style of gameplay. ALL of them are motivated not by a desire for realism, but by, for lack of a better term, "butthurt". I will agree, 1000%, that there are 12 year old little twat nuggets that run around camping spawn spots killing people the moment they spawn and screaming over direct "OWWWNNNED BITCH!" and generally acting like total douche bags. But any system that punishes them punishes everyone else as well. So many of you requesting a "ptsd" or "psychological degradation" mechanic, and fail utterly to understand what that would ACTUALLY imply. If my character developed PTSD, he would become highly paranoid, jumping at shadows, highly alert, and even MORE prone to violence. You can NOT implement a psychological effect in a game in a way that is accurate, realistic, relevant, and makes sense. If it is any consolation, private hives will be coming eventually. When they do, join a hive that disallows KoS, and play in your merry little carebear world, free from the fear, adrenaline, and excitement brought to this game by the threat of people who do this.

Your idea is just like mine, except, I think, simpler. http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/171832-realisitc-inventory-space-proposal/page-2 in this thread, I proposed something similar, buy your idea is easier, I think. Items and containers have volume, yet you can still see and move around the item icon. The items icon, I think should also be bigger, proportionate to its volume. But in my thread I mention an idea that could be added to yours, the concept of "stretch". What do you think?

no. Im practical and realistic. Hackers exist, yes. And you are naïve to expect them to ever go away entirely. Ban waves come and go, script kiddies loose $30, buy another copy, rinse and repeat. Over 120 hours of game time, and I have yet to see a single hacker myself. In the mod, I saw them DAILY. in the end, the private hive I played on got attacked almost hourly, forcing character rollbacks every time. Got so bad I quit the mod. Nobody is ruining this game purely with KOS. If you cant take it, and deal with the loss of your digital items, go play hello kitty. Sorry, but I have zero sympathy.

YES, it is. You are asking for the implementation of a mechanic that PUNISHES me for my gameplay choices in a manner that attempts to CONTROLL how I play the game. Outside of the risk of death or injury when engaging in combat, there should be no punishment. Its a game. Not reality. Its meant to be realistic, not real. I also doubt you ask for this purely for the sake of realism, but rather because you are tired of being kosed. In the game's future, more mechanics, like base building, and vehicles, and a reworked medical system, will offer more tools, variety, and opportunity for character interaction, thereby encouraging character interaction, and reducing, to some degree, the amount of PVP. But PVP will always be there. Further, a sanity mechanic can not be implemented realistically. EVERY single person reacts to, and deals with trauma in vastly different ways and severity. I experienced very mild PTSD when I came back from Iraq (often heard IEDs exploding in the distance while at camp Fallujah, or hear gunshots. Never got attacked, was never in any actual danger myself). Upon return, loud noises drew my attention VERY fast. Suddenly I would become highly alert and ready, but would quickly realize that nothing was wrong, and return to normal. Some people see the horrors and rigors of brutal, bloody combat first hand, and later fail to bat an eyelash over it. Others experience LESS than I did, and have uncontrollable nightmares and depression, coupled with violent outbursts and reactions to the simplest things. You cannot implement a sanity system complicated enough to be done right. The game is in alpha. More tools for character interaction and cooperation will be coming. Until then, many of us are bored, and seek the thrill of pvp for a while.

All for it, and excited by it. IMO, should be server specific, should NOT vanish on death (might prevent me from finding one if the player died just before I found it), and should have limited storage space (allow for say, no more than two mountain backpacks worth of inventory). Just my 2 cents

Did not read. Just wanted to say this: NO RESTRAINTS. NO RESTRICTIONS. You do NOT get to dictate how I play any more than anyone else gets to dictate how YOU play. Dean Hall has already EXPLICITLY stated that he and the devs will NOT implement any kind of feature that attempts to control certain behavior in game, with the exception of cheating or using exploits.

No, it isn't. But your average player wont have the same mentality about it. How many, do you think? HOW MANY? How many 12 year olds will be playing this game, running around dangling their dicks in your face shouting obscenities. or running around a naked girl? Sorry, but this is the last thing I want to see in this game. And I mean the LAST THING. I would accept the total removal of zombies from the game before I EVER wanted to see this. I WARN YOU ALL: these things being implemented (I don't believe the ever will be, which is why I see this thread as a waste, but that's just my opinion, nothing more) will result in a MASSIVE wave of untold amounts of immaturity ranging from the childish to the blatantly offensive. EXAMPLE: You get held up by a gang of middle school age players playing as bandits. They hold you at gunpoint, cuff you, and rob you of everything. All good. Next, they disrobe you. Then one of them takes off his pants, and underwear, gets behind you, and does some weird goofy character movement involving crouching or bending over or whatever, and "rapes" you. Next, you hear a highpitched, pre-pubescent voice say "HAHA, FAGGOT! YOU JUST GOT ASS RAPED! NOW UR A FAG, FAGGOT!". DO NOT TRY AND TELL ME THIS OR SOMETHING LIKE IT WONT HAPPEN! YOU KNOW GOD-DAMNED WELL IT WILL! The last thing I want to see in this game is MORE childish bullshit like this. I understand that IRL, something like this COULD happen, but as somebody said in another, unrelated thread, this ISNT REALITY TV, here. Its a GAME, and therefore some aspect of it is "casual" in nature. I come here every day for RECREATION, not to have tits, dicks, ass, shit, or piss rubbed in my face. I have zero interest in allowing people, 12 years old or 50, to exercise their bizarre homo erotic domination/scat sexual fantasies on me.

how are these bots getting in? Isnt there a captcha requirement to make an account? Or have the bots evolved to understand distorted images of text?

And that would have to be a trade off. If you want the benefit of a structure or base, you will need a way to efficiently transport material, like say, a vehicle. You cant fit a 12 foot long 2X4 in your backpack, any more than a 6 foot x 6 foot sheet of plywood would fit in your pants. Without a vehicle, you would have to carry it in your hands, slowly. In terms of base construction (assuming that it is implemented in this manner, we really have no idea), this encourages team work as well.

Bump, forgot about this thread I made for a while. In response to the above: I like the way you are thinking, but this doesn't change or help with the fact that our inventory system, while very user friendly, is still unrealistic, and frankly arbitrary (also, please see my thread about utility belts for a very detailed suggestion on the matter). It may be true that I CAN carry an ammo can in my pants by packing it in they way I did in the video above, but this realistically is extremely impractical, uncomfortable, and limiting in mobility. Tying one to my belt (another suggestion made above), while also possible, makes just as little sense: that much weight (a full can weighs about 30-40 pounds) hanging from your side, front, or back would severely un balance you, constantly get in the way as you attempt to move around (swinging around and what not), or, even if it were secured tightly, would quickly chafe, and stress muscles very seriously as you compensate for the weight hanging on one side. It makes even LESS sense that I can fit that same ammo can in a SHIRT. TTsKO, hoodie, tactical, etc. IMO, if you want to have the benefit of carrying an ammo can, you should be forced to put it someplace that makes SENSE, like a backpack. This whole concept also ties in nicely with my thread about the utility belt, for which I will leave a link below. Currently, it just seems to me that so many items don't take up as much inventory space as they should, or they take up too much. Why is a walkie talkie radio half the "size" of an ammo can? its actually SMALLLER than a pistol, yet a pistol is the same "size" as an ammo can. Why am I able to somehow fit a fire axe in my hunting backpack, yet the actually in game model CLEARLY shows that its length would not allow this? I really think that we should be FORCED to carry items in a way that makes sense. I shouldn't be able to stuff my ammo can in my pants, but I SHOULD have 4 separate pockets that could each hold a pistol. My fire axe shouldn't fit inside my hunting backpack.... With my idea or some version of it, it would be possible to have several pistol mags or speed loaders in a single pocket, reserving space in my backpack for other things like ammo cans, or storage boxes. Eventually, we will have a use and a NEED for cooking pots and frying pans. Neither of these items would fit inside my assault vest. They WOULD fit inside my backpack. With a realistic inventory system based on volume (but still user friendly), I would be able to relegate all those small, one inventory slot items to smaller pockets (4 FNx mags does not equal one cooking pot), freeing up room in the backpack for larger items that one could not, or simply would not (for practical reason) carry elsewhere. I honestly believe this game will NEED a volume based inventory system at some point. But as said, ANYTHING, including the current system, is better than the arma 2 version. Utility belt thread: http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/174509-canteens-utility-belts-and-more-now-with-pictures/

Do we really need this thread? It amazes me how many have actually voted yes for both. I realize that it is realistic, in the sense that IRL you COULD run around fully naked, and that excretion of bodily waste is a necessary function of life. But this is a game. I REALY don't think we need this kind of thing for this game. It would just draw more childishness and immaturity. People would start force feeding you bodily fluids, handcuffing you and striping you naked so they can.... God. Do I really need to go into detail? Use your imagination, and then tell me that you HONESTLY think people should be allowed to do these things. Force feeding me alcohol, rotten fruit, or bleach is one thing. But THIS gets into an entirely different realm of sexualized abuse that is, frankly, offensive to me. I am a mature adult, and I have ZERO interest in seeing, doing, or tolerating this kind of behavior in a game that is meant, I think, for a mature audience. We have enough problems as it is with some of the younger players acting like worthless trolls in this game already. Honestly, to ANYONE who thinks either of these things should be implemented: Grow the fuck up.

Yes, in fact. Had a slight delay due to a glitched character (logged in after a server restart with all of my gear gone and broken legs). After respawning and acquiring the necessities, I can rule out the following places for infection: Black Mountain, with the exception of the castle, where zombies do spawn. The surrounding forest is clear. Green Mountain with the exception of the tower facility. The surrounding forest is clear. And Lesnoy Khrebet forest. Updating OP now. EDIT: Camp Lesnoy still requires investigation with a radio.

Daily bump. Any developers care to chime in with their thoughts?

I still don't understand why so many are adamantly against it. Pros: Players can give the middle finger a rest. Enables the use of other functions (alt to look around, inventory manipulation, etc) without have to do finger gymnastics that wear on the hand muscles, and continue towards our objectives. Gives us a chance to sort of "sit back and enjoy the view", in a sense, enabling us to just let our characters run without constant input from us. Affects other player's gameplay in no way whatsoever. Players that don't like it don't have to do it. Cons: Some players may abuse this, setting their characters to run while they go piss, smoke, eat, whatever. I don't see any other cons. And that last one STILL has no effect on anyone else. If anything, players doing this would be taking a huge risk. They might run off a cliff, a sharp incline that breaks their legs, get spotted and shot, hit an obstacle 30 seconds into the run and go NOWHERE (and possible get discovered and shot). Any player that did this would be STUPID. And they would pay for it eventually. And it STILL does not affect anyone else, with the exception that somebody might end up with some free stuff. I do this (with a quarter) to give my hand a break, simplify the gameplay somewhat, and I am always right there, watching and interacting. I still don't see a valid argument that shows this SHOULDNT be a feature. And it is the one thing that I think the devs and dean have gotten wrong.

IRL, the rear sight aperture is necessary to properly attain correct sight alignment (tip of the front sight post centered in the opening of the rear sight aperture), which when combined with correct sight picture (maintaining correct sight alignment while aligning the tip of the front sight post with your target, center mass) enables one to shoot accurately. Without the rear sight aperture, a shooter IRL would have no way of knowing if the rear of the rifle was in line with their target. The front sight post could be aimed at the target, but the rear of the weapon could be canted slightly left or right. In CQ, this would not be too much of a problem, but at range, that slight shift would mean the difference between hitting your target or missing completely. ESPECIALLY at distances of 300m or more. IN GAME, however, I suspect that it makes no difference. IRL, when you put the weapon in your shoulder you do it differently every time. Even with practice, nobody would be able to shoulder it and ADS the EXACT same way, EVERY TIME. In game, you do not have this problem. The character shoulders the weapon the way it is PROGRAMED to, and the front sight post will always therefore point exactly at what you are aiming for. Frankly, I think its bullshit, but....alpha. Without the carry handle sights attached, a character in game SHOULD suffer from reduced accuracy, and the loss of the ability to zero the weapon. Yes, the elevation of the front sight post can still be changed, but without the rear sights to properly align the weapon, it should be irrelevant.