xximrtwoixx

Most nvgs can work in complete darkness as they have secondary IR illuminators that act as flashlights to nvgs but are not visible to naked eye....

Rrrrrr

Being an advocate for persistent storage doesnt mean you are a hacker/exploiter. Locking gear from characters has many issues because it can be bypassed by groups, or entails massive amounts of tracking data that needs to be checked in near real time. I think fixing the issues like duping, hacking, inflation, etc would provide a better solution. I also think new content needs to be added that gives characters intrinsic value outside of their gear, this is the only way to change the way people think/play.

Nice post, I'd give my beans but I'm on mobile... You didnt address the loot economy at all though, IMO this is one of the biggest issues that needs to be adressed.

There have been serval posts discussing the game's loot/gear economy and how screwed up it is, I have posted a similar suggestion within some of those posts, but as I believe this would be the best solution and provide the most authentic experiance I am creating a thread for the suggestion. I will try to keep this from being TLDR, but it will explained in detail. People blame scripters/dupers for all of the high end gear currently floating around the game economy, I believe and as some others have pointed out this is merely an acceleration of the game's economy. Set loot spawns do not really make things more rare, they simply increase the amount of time it takes to aquire a given item, all items are actually available in infinite numbers. Players have the ability to farm any system that is uncapped to aquire whatever they wish based on the amount of time they wish to spend farming. Because "good" items are not discarded this means they will persist because they will always be taken. Over time the number of these items that are available will continue to increase until they are commonly possesed by players even though the time needed to spawn them remains high. This issue can be addressed through added loot sinks like damage or wear to gear, but the odds remain that players would keep these better items in good repair so the effect of loot sinks would be minimal. Randomization of item loss after death would have an effect, but IMO this is unauthentic, and because these items would make up a smaller percentage of total items held random removal would effect them less than common items like food/water. I believe the best solution to introduce actual scarcity would be to cap the total number of items available to all players, this is how and why I believe this to be the best solution. How: Loot possesion rates via player inventory or storage are saved both to the Hive and individual servers. The rate of possesion can be calculated by combining these numbers, and once the possession rate reaches the items spawn rate (Or a desired percentage) that item will no longer spawn. It's spawn percentage chance or its place in the loot table will be converted to generic "trash" loot or cans. This would ensure that other items do not have inflated spawn chances as the total number of items spawned is not changed. All items outside of trash would become scarce, as they truly exhist in finite numbers based on the number of players. (Certain items could be excluded if it is deemed that they are required or should always be available, ie water bottles, melee weapons, or even basic sidearms/rifles like mak's or whinny's) To implement this in a way that saves resources within the game the mechanic could be set to run daily, where a nightly job calculates all possesion and then updates the loot tables. The loot table files are held on the hive and when the server updates or restarts it queries these numbers and sets them accordingly. This will save resources and ensure that possesion numbers are close enough to the desired numbers. The alternative would be querring the tables each time loot is generated and that would create to much lag. Why: True scarcity of items would make survival more of an active task, as you would need to truly hunt for food, ammo, weapons etc. This system would also authentically simulate the migration of goods from set pre shtf locations to player created storage. Finding items would also truly be rewarding as you could no longer simply count on finding everything you need/want when you go to a given location. This same principle could be applied to animal spawn chance based on meat possesion rates, thus all food could truly become scarce. True scarcity would also influence player actions, there are countless threads complaining about snipers/griefers if items are truly scarce these actions would be reduced without removing or punishing certain actions in game. Hopping from server to server in an attempt to get loot would also be reduced IMO because chances for items would be the same, once all the AS50's are gone they gone, you have to hunt someone down and take it from their cold dead hands if you want one. This would also extend the amount of required play time to be geared up or be ready to DM, as this increases the number of people taking these actions decreases because when they die they lose this time. Thus this mechanic reduces DM without ever punishing it directly, so players are still free to do so if they wish. This would also increase the effects of perma death as lost items will be scooped up by other players, and because the amount of play time to aquire items is increased the butt hurt over losing that invested time will increase. This equates to less stupid actions by players. This mechanic could also serve to control other issues that effect gameplay or content like abuse of above ground fortifications, when they are in a pack or set and exhist they are added to the possesion number thus players would not be able to use them to build elaborate unauthentic structures. This would then allow for more above ground fortification content to be added. This mechanic also adds value to exhisting content, with ammo auto duping on log in fixed true scarcity of ammo would add major bonuses to weapons that have more commonly available ammo types like shotguns and civilian rifles. This system is also something that is achievable, the more authentic scenario would be all items spawn simply at once but that would be impossible due to engine limitations. This system could be expanded and tested to generate certain game play, over time all item number's could be reduced to simulate the ever increasing scarcity of supplies when there are none coming into the region to replace them. This could even be used to introduce a countdown type of mechanic, once everything is gone all things are reset as everyone would die. This mechanic would directly provide gameplay as it creates an active task for the player, it would also not limit or stop certain gameplay the way removal of storage or a massive reduction in inventory would. Why Not: (Flaws or changes in gameplay) Admin Abuse: Admins manipulate restarts to game the system. -Response: This already occurs and will always occur as long as the community is in possesion of servers. Server clans would simply go from having 20 of everything to maybe 1 or 2 of them, you would still be able to kill and take whatever you wish from them. Hard to get loot: Noobs or even vets struggle to find any loot - Response: This is the point to a degree, I also believe its true that your less likely to be killed if your not fully equiped. I think this would cause under equiped players to seek out better equiped players for protection thus building bonds while unarmed that reduce the chances of betrayal latter. As a last resort this could be minimized by allowing certain items to never be capped. Other people have all the good shit: A small percentage of players are more likley to be in possesion of a large percent of good items. - Response: This is what happens when things are scarce, those that excel end up with more pie than those that don't. This IMO is simply added content as it makes finding better items more of an active task and extends the time it takes a player to be successful at it. It also makes players that are in possesion of good items charish them more as they know that it puts a target on their back. IMO its also true that most weapons only really have a precieved advantage over each other, tactics and player skill are much more important than what weapon you have, so long as you have a weapon. Also as above cetrain items can be uncapped to ensure everyone has a chance to let their actual skill decide their fate. People that quit playing effect the game economy: When a player quits playing and is still alive the loot they posses remains taken off of the loot tables -Response: This can be addressed via counters for days not logged in before weapon is readded or removed from player inventory. I want to DM in Cherno: I want to only pvp and taking my playtime to find guns sucks. - Response: You still have the ability to PVP to your hearts content, your not punished, you simply have to find a gun like everyone else. Scarcity means increased banditry: Players are more likely to be in conflict over resources when there are fewer resources - Response: I think this simply adds legitimacy to banditry as items are truly scarce, no longer is there an infinite supply for those that want to spend the time looking. If you don't believe banditry is a legitimate survival technique we have a fundemental disagreement I guess. I also think this could server to reduce KOS or Random Killing indirectly, simply because the weapons/ammo required to do so would be more valuable than the lulz for killing to a majority of players. Also if someone is unarmed they pose little threat, and if they only have the same shit you do your less likely to shoot them (Items that aren't capped). Furthermore altruistic actions would be more rewarding because using precious resources on a random stranger would truly say alot about your character. TLDR: Please read the why nots before posting one of them... Capping the number of items via dynamic possesion rates will add inderect controls that modify the majority of player actions and add content because it will take longer or be impossible to become fully geared. It is also the only way to have an authentic loot mechanic that can not be farmed.

I guess OP was IB4 my post, not sure if it was before I said the same thing in multiple other threads though Here's my proposal, it isn't actually dynamic but based on daily updates. There would still be differences between different servers though because servers store what is in player storage and what is on the ground. Best way to have a real economy is to get rid of community servers IMO. http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/83090-dynamic-hard-loot-caps/

Because the Z's are really living infected people killing them should also reduce your humanity, they are just sick people after all. Why don't all the care bears take up ethical treatment for Z's as a cause, your still murdering living people so whats the difference?

I like anything that makes weapon handling more realistic, and I also agree that magazine's should act as fillable containers for bullets. All of these parts are great in your suggestion and btw this has been suggested numerous times. I'm not sure what your talking about when you say guns fire multiple calibers, this isn't really true. There can be alot of differences between cartridges like bullet weights or amount/type of powder but the size of the actual bullet (diameter) is always the same, and that is what caliber means. The size of the cartridge is also always the same.

I like that being forced to survive through the night equals ruining the game. I like the suggestion, the day penalty not so much because people adapt to whatever sleep patern they need. I like the scale that the different items allow, and that fire can be used as a short cut with disadvantages.

Thanks for the positive feed back, I hope these types of considerations are examined by Dev's. I think that this type of feature really belongs in Beta, but I think the more data that is avialable the better the tweaks to possesion caps can be. The only way to get data is to have glitches fixed and implement some type of cap though.

If you have a learn by doing then people will sit at camp and farm that skill, or go on specific farming runs then put the book into storage or another group member. I'm not saying this is extemely unauthentic in itself, but some actions it could lead to would be very unauthentic, like bandaging if they are shooting each other just to bandage. Matches would be maxed in minutes becaues someone would simply start X amount of fires in a row. I think your intentions are authentic because if you don't know how to do something but have a manual your able to learn from it while you attempt an action. I think it would be better to have a simple possession timer rather than a set number of actions. IE book in possession you can do X, after X days of book being in your possession you don't need to have it to take X action. IMO hoarding is an issue with this because it allows a player or group to easily relearn skills after death. I think this will reduce the effects of perma death and I think that is a major area where skills/specialization can come into play. I agree that suicide for skills could be an issue, if they are selectable at spawn, but if skills are able to generate enough attachment to a character, ie the player doesn't want to lose the skills they have, then death by any means would be avoided. I do realize that groups would be at an advantage with any system simply because it allows the individual members to be more specialized. This can be a disadvantage also, for example if they lost their medic and he was the only one with medical skills, they are now at a huge disadvantage. I also think that selection should work more as a barreir for entry than a one choice of mastery. Your book mechanic works like this, if they don't have the book they can't even attempt an action. If the skill or specialization is simply the start, and then over time it grows at a set rate or you can grow it based on points for surviving then older characters will always be more valuable than new characters. IMO this is authentic just because no matter what your specialization or skills before SHTF doing those things without modern technology are vastly different.

I like OP's idea, but I would prefer learning skills from other players rather than books. At character creation you get to pick some stuff one of them being abilities/skills. You can teach these to other players, or they learn by observing you do them. This would be authentic and also have the benefit of causing people to group up. Also the issue that Raventhorn highlighted would be bypassed, if a group is killed they have to start all over learning their skills w/no advantage thus perma death hurts more. I think the number of skills needs to be high enough that it would be unlikely that small groups know all skills.

Why do you want abilities tied to equipment? If you find a medical bag does that mean you know how to perform surgery? If you find some wrenches you can now repair a car? Do you want it this way because its easy for you to gain these abilities and then pass them on to your next life by looting your body? Why do you dislike skill systems, is it because you can't operate at a selected disadvantage or are you afraid of losing everything in perma death? How log does it take a player to master the operations they need to know? I understand there is a steep curve for players that haven't played arma or maybe haven't played a mod before but once this is overcome there is little left to master, especailly because everything is available via wiki's. If nothing is going to add intrinsic value to a character you simply have a long round of free for all DM where you find your weapons and have to eat. I want more out of DayZ.

I think bases should use exhisting structures that way players can't "ruin" the map, they simply can fortify exhisiting buildings. There can be levels of fortification that require specific numbers of resources and specific actions. Yes buildings within a server could be made off limits to everyone but this is authentic IMO. Fortifications and buildings can be destroyed so go destroy it if your pissed. There could be an interface added to each building that allows a player to "give" it resources for fortifications. Example: Hanger Building: Fortification 1: Door down and locked. Secondary door is locked/barricaded. (can pull in vehicle) Fortification 2: Main door and secondary door are reinforced with steel plates (scrap metal) Fortification 3: Main door welded shut (Can no longer pull in vehicle) House: Fortification 1: Door is barricaded Fortificaiton 2: Windows boarded up and door reinforced Fortification 3: Windows/doors are reinforced/covered with scrap metal Hotel: Fortification 1: Stairwell door barricaded Fortificaiton 2: Stairwell door reinforced rope ladders in elevator Fortification 3: Stairwell destroyed, pulley's and crane added to elevator shaft These could even be available out of sequence so you have the choice to destroy stairs/doors for more security or retain their functionality at less security.

I would prefer if it worked just as it does now, gear stays on your body until your body is deleted or server resets, this would also take care of weapons that are left in the enviornment (dropped) or griefing scenarios, though the actual rarity of items would be so great I don't think anyone would try to grief with them, it would actually be as illogical as it would be in an authentic scenario.

IMO you need to throw out your toughness perk, no perks/skills etc should improve blood or give "HP" to characters, this takes away from the equality in PVP. To those that don't want "dice rolls" to decide pvp you have forgotten about the spread mechanic that exhists in DayZ. This mechanic alters the angle that your barrel is pointed when you fire shots and fairly randomly effects your accuracy. Go shoot a makorov or 1911 and you can see what I'm talking about, these things you complain about are already in the game.

I don't understand how people view staying alive as enough reward in itself, is it fun to sit around in the woods watching your food/water go down before you crack into your massive supply of items? People stock up, then simply go DM or loot farm more, if cars/camp get stolen they go get them back then go back to DMing. This is what our group does, there simply isn't enough content or play value because everything is infinite and you can build up your own private massive store. IMO the answer is capping gear not giving rewards for staying alive, this adds in countless hours of play time because finding and defending supplies would be an active task at all times. I also think skills/speacilizations that are taken away on death are the only way to give characters intrinsic value, the problem is to many people would be butt hurt over their character's death, and people don't want to put hours into something that can be taken away by the whim of another player.

Bumping thread because I believe it's the best solution to inflation that has been posted, and no one has provided an objection that was not directly addressed in OP.

OP is talking about inflation, your correct that he sees weapon decay as the solution. Addressing hacking and duplication will slow inflation, but in the end as OP states even when not considering these factors inflation will occur and over time even items with very low spawn chance will become very common. Sinks like decay or random removal can't address inflation and remain authentic IMO.

I don't understand why you want to remove the ability to play with your friends, I see many suggestions that want to limit or eliminate this. Don't you get more enjoyment playing a game with your friends? I also think its unrealisitic to expect players to join up in random spontaneous groups when they are at risk of losing everything they've worked for. An hour or two of cooperation is not worth the risk of losing days/weeks worth of play time. As more content is added in that allows players to accomplish more this will continue to diminish, players must turn to outside avenues to join groups or find friendlies. Random ecnounters will always have a high chance for violence. Counters are always going to be BS, they try to track dynamic actions in an arbitrary way thus they will never be able to accuratley track "humanity". Also skins are BS and deafeated by the fact that other wearable skins are in the game. IMO all items active/inactive need to be displayed on the character model as this will tell you by looking what a player values and more than likely how they are going to act.

I recently heard Rocket talk about group play dyanimcs like spawning with a group and how this can really unbalance the game for players not in a group. This as well as some additional thoughts for things that I constantly see requests for inspired me to write this proposal. Point Buy Character Creation -What it is: These systems give a player a set amount of points to purchase skills, perks, etc when they create a character. This is usually found in RPG systems and has replaced random stat generation because people will only game those systems until they have maximised a benefit from them. How it could work in DayZ: - Points you get: You start with X amount of points to purchase different "perks" these don't have to be IG skills necessarily but could be benefits that players desire. To generate the ever needed pool of tears that the Hive servers require for cooling these points could be set to only regenerate every 24hours for a given player ID, this would punish people that constantly die. -What you do with Points: Skills would be one obvious avenue for points to be used, (This thread isn't about skills or their place in DayZ, but if they were/are included you could purchase them with point buy) starting equipment could also be purchased with these points (weapons, food, packs, etc), starting locations (Group, city, country, specific. They could have different values), Immunity to the Z virus (if infection were to be included), etc. (Anything and everything that a player may attribute value to could be included.) - The effect of point buy in DayZ: This would introduce a way to balance out players spawning on their group, ie it costs all your points to do so. Players that have a harder path, ie alone in a random locaiton, can outfit themselves to a degree that would assist them. In the end this type of system could provide a measured reward v risk for players to take and satisfy some of the complaints that are constantly posted. The system is also capable of being balanced or fine tuned over time, if starting weapons are an issue then remove ammunition or increase their cost to purchase, etc. Rewards can also be introduced like survive for x days and recieve a bonus x points at your next spawn, etc.

WTF is wrong with people, this has nothing to do with skills, perks, attributes etc. Point buy is mechanic that allows people to customize their character/experiance by purchasing things that have weighted values from a limited pool. This could be gear like a bandage, pain killers, morphine, bullets, back packs, etc. It could be skins/clothes, whatever. Its about giving the player the ability to sacrifice certain things because they attribute more value to others, its about tailoring your experaince the way you see fit. IMO this fits into DayZ because it's your story, this simply gives you the ability to give your character some back story. Because points are limited no one is able to generate a significant advantage, it simply makes you realize as a player from the begnining that everything has an advantage/disadvantage and its up to you to make these tough choices that your characters survival will depend on. If you want to remark on what is or isn't included fine, but this is about the mechanic not what is included. Other mechanics could be used to accomplish these same things, classes, open spawn locations, etc. I want people to be able to choose, and those choices to have a price.

Every minute logged in a player risks death from a variety of sources, thus players look to maximize their return against the threat they are under. This is why you see suicide runs on the S coast and farmers/hoppers up north. The inability to store items wouldn't stop farming it would simply mean that farming sessions are shorter in length because peopple couldn't store what they've farmed. The real question for your suggestion is what would no storage motivate people to do? This would only eliminate what little positive actions players can take, what is the point of building a base if there is no storage or what would be the point in gathering supplies? This would only increase the death match mentality because there would be no point in subjecting yourself to risk, goals would be to get only what you can carry then play runs out. Storage creates immergent play and gives players an option to plan and coordinate with each other to be successful. Without it you simply have massive Dm where everyone exhists hand to mouth until they are killed. You say it doesn't work they way I state then say it does.... Any system/mechanic devised to stop or reduce farming will be min/maxed even if its not exploitable, though how it would not be exploitable would be up for debate. Even your proposed system would simply push players farther out to "reset" the spawns. It doesn't accomplish anything only makes it "harder" for people to exploit. As long as the loot that spawns there is of high value and farming is faster than moving to another location people will simply farm away. Helicopter crashes are exploited/farmed just as heavily as anything else, the issue with them is that it can only be done by those affiliated with the server administartion. They know when restarts occur, and restarts can also be done to assist with this farming. I don't understand how this is better than something that everyone can/can't do. I would also agrgue that ruins immersion to not reset or generate loot for players, the reason loot isn't there isn't because its actually there but becaues the server hasn't restarted or some other gamey reason. This doesn't add to play it only makes players consider things outside the game. Immersion is also effected by loot disappearing from a given location because of player presence, a military base should be full of supplies until they are exhausted, if a group wants to make that base their home and go through the trouble of securing it why should they not have access to all of the equipment there? Why waste time with stop gaps, capping loot is a better solution because it adds play value and solves the issue. In a capped system loot is distributed by the players so your goal of players being pushed across the map is met, it also introduces an economy and scarcity and both of these things would contribute to immergent play.

IMO incresing switch to secondary should only be increased if a player is able to find a better sling, if you have a two point it should be stowing to your shoulder. Switch to pack weapon should take minutes, not the insta switch crap that exhists now..

Loot doesnt spawn only at restart, it has a chance to clear and respawn for each new character coming to loot location. If it is cleared ie loot taken then it respawns at next trigger or after set time if player that triggered is still at location. So your numbers are way to small.... Attrition or degradation would have to occur at to fast a rate to even come close to having any effect on the loot economy.