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marcheur

1.0 ? Dont expect anything until coders say so...

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WTF bohemia interactive or any relative people speaking about it, we face things. Don't trust anything. Don't be a new player. or only when it's free. What I face as server owner and what people tell me, game is NOT ready. bugs every now and then. Yes they did good job on almost everything, but when you claim what you claim, you are supposed to have a product close to perfection. Guess what ? It's not. So guess what, do your job (finish the game ?) and I will do mine (not telling people you did not finish the game ?). Bohemia interactive, it was almost perfect. Problem is coming from one word : almost. Beleive me if you guyz don't do what ya have to do to solve everything in a very short time, I will use my own time explain people why they should not give you one cent. I hope message is received.

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I don't think they see 1.0 as finished or even close to being finished. It was just dumb to give it the 1.0 tag on it.

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1.0 - Provides BASIC and CORE features in a stable state with no major bugs. <--- DayZ 1.0 does that. 1.0 doesn't mean by ANY means "finall" "finished" product. 

Development doesn't stop here, its just a number that means they left Early Access, which this game didn't needed in its current state. There is still more to come. 

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well yes, of course there is more to come (most people will see the joke here), but a disapearing car, with its content, and all that involves hours of looting to make it work.... comon hahaha. I mean, it's the best joke ever about our society right now :D I dont expect it to be perfect, not even close to it. Just to be acceptable, and yea it's not....

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I know how you feel.  I've been waiting for WoW to finish so I can play it.  It's almost been 15 years and they keep releasing content. They are close to perfection.  I think they be almost done.  Problem is coming from one word: almost.

Don't trust anything. Don't be a new player. or only when it's free.

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2 hours ago, Vernon_Price said:

1.0 - Provides BASIC and CORE features in a stable state with no major bugs. <--- DayZ 1.0 does that. 1.0 doesn't mean by ANY means "finall" "finished" product. 

Development doesn't stop here, its just a number that means they left Early Access, which this game didn't needed in its current state. There is still more to come. 

I don't entirely agree with that. As long as there is a problem with persistence or it needs a workaround, it is not a 1.0 with "basic and core features in a stable state with no major bugs".

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3 hours ago, marcheur said:

..//..   I hope message is received.

ROFL
that will sure strike TERROR & FEAR into the heart of every programmer who EVER sat at a keyboard..  Sure scared the sheet out of me!..  Well I'm sawing my rig to pieces and burying it in the garden right now. 

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11 minutes ago, IMT said:

I don't entirely agree with that. As long as there is a problem with persistence or it needs a workaround, it is not a 1.0 with "basic and core features in a stable state with no major bugs".

Maybe the real problem is that they showcased the DayZ 1.0 Gameplay Trailer with basebuilding elements.  And cars.  Maybe they should have stuck to selling the product without teasing basebuilding and cars.  Originally, iirc, DayZ was about surviving, zombies, and other players.  Basebuilding was kind of added as a thing for modders to play with. Original plan was to have the title be mod-friendly.  Basebuildings helps sell this, but was it part of the core features?  Should it be?  Well, it is now!!

Related,(?) Has anyone seen a truck on 1.0?  I have a large stash of truck batteries, wheels, and hoods saved up.  Still looking for a glow plug and a diesel pump though.

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37 minutes ago, Parazight said:

Maybe the real problem is that they showcased the DayZ 1.0 Gameplay Trailer with basebuilding elements.  And cars.  Maybe they should have stuck to selling the product without teasing basebuilding and cars.  Originally, iirc, DayZ was about surviving, zombies, and other players.  Basebuilding was kind of added as a thing for modders to play with. Original plan was to have the title be mod-friendly.  Basebuildings helps sell this, but was it part of the core features?  Should it be?  Well, it is now!!

Related,(?) Has anyone seen a truck on 1.0?  I have a large stash of truck batteries, wheels, and hoods saved up.  Still looking for a glow plug and a diesel pump though.

In the server files, the V3S is still set to not active, so it must not be ready yet.

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2 hours ago, Parazight said:

Maybe the real problem is that they showcased the DayZ 1.0 Gameplay Trailer with basebuilding elements.  And cars.  Maybe they should have stuck to selling the product without teasing basebuilding and cars.  Originally, iirc, DayZ was about surviving, zombies, and other players.  Basebuilding was kind of added as a thing for modders to play with. Original plan was to have the title be mod-friendly.  Basebuildings helps sell this, but was it part of the core features?  Should it be?  Well, it is now!!

Related,(?) Has anyone seen a truck on 1.0?  I have a large stash of truck batteries, wheels, and hoods saved up.  Still looking for a glow plug and a diesel pump though.

That's not entirely true, persistence/CLE plays a big role in DayZ's core, a very big one. It isn't only camps or bases, it's everything. When you log into a server, you start where you left last time, that's persistence. See an item or a dead infected laying around which isn't yours? That indicates recent activity from someone else which helps you survive those other players, that's persistence. The server restarts and you log back in and see an item on the floor which you just dropped, that's persistence. You pitched a tent and put stuff in there, next time you login, it's still there, that's persistence. It has a big impact on the game and without it, DayZ wouldn't be the same. Building a base is more than a toy for modders. In a survival game in a post-apocalyptic world, having a place which you can call home adds to your story. I'd say it is a core feature of the game and the developers have stated multiple times that it's an important aspect of DayZ's core.

Edited by IMT
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1 hour ago, IMT said:

Still looking for a glow plug and a diesel pump

saw a glowplug in a blue caravan yesterday. It didn't show up unless you stood close to it.

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1 hour ago, IMT said:

The server restarts and you log back in and see an item on the floor which you just dropped, that's persistence.

only erected tents, barrels, cars or built structures - are persistent, in the same way stuff you wear or place in your inventory is persistent. That's persistence. Drop something on the ground, a log, a gun, planks, a piece of meat, a hat, a hammer, (a dead body), and in a while it won't be there.  Scattered stuff despawns and respawns. (loot economy, remember?) How do you expect objects to SPAWN if they always stay in the same place however many times the server restarts ?  That's persistence. Say this helmet is ruined - so you drop it and you want it to lie around ruined FOR EVER ?  Wouldn't it be a good idea if it respawned one day ? That's persistence, and always has been since persistance started.

Right now there's a glitch concerning the limited special objects that are SUPPOSED to be persistent. But it's nothing to do with what persistence is FOR or what it is ABOUT.

Would be nice if dead bodies lay around longer, like they used to.. but they don't .. (for server efficiency I guess?). They don't have time to attract flies these days. 

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14 hours ago, Parazight said:

Don't be a new player.

ROFL ..
If you want to be a new player - just DON'T expect everything to be easy.. this is NOT an EASY GAME..   it was DESIGNED to worry, enrage, panic, and stress players and make life HARD for them. And then Kill them. Since then it's got a damn sight easier.  But the easier it gets the MORE players complain that they have no idea what's going on. They have some dumb idea this game is supposed to be "fair". I don't know where they got that from? Playing too much Mario maybe ?

If you want HELL, and you want it to be Unfair, Glitchy, Dramatic, Unexpected, Crazy, and Suddenly Change the rules when you aren't looking out for it.. then WELCOME to DayZ. This game will hit you with an iron pipe and steal your boots.  If you don't like that, STAY AWAY.

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3 hours ago, pilgrim* said:

ROFL ..
If you want to be a new player - just DON'T expect everything to be easy.. this is NOT an EASY GAME..   it was DESIGNED to worry, enrage, panic, and stress players and make life HARD for them. And then Kill them. Since then it's got a damn sight easier.  But the easier it gets the MORE players complain that they have no idea what's going on. They have some dumb idea this game is supposed to be "fair". I don't know where they got that from? Playing too much Mario maybe ?

If you want HELL, and you want it to be Unfair, Glitchy, Dramatic, Unexpected, Crazy, and Suddenly Change the rules when you aren't looking out for it.. then WELCOME to DayZ. This game will hit you with an iron pipe and steal your boots.  If you don't like that, STAY AWAY.

Sorry, I was just parroting the sage advice from the thread creator.  And no, this is an easy game.  At least surviving the elements is.  Other players is a whole other thing.  Definitely not a fair game though.  That's a good thing.

15 hours ago, IMT said:

That's not entirely true, persistence/CLE plays a big role in DayZ's core, a very big one.

My point was that it shouldn't have been showcased in the 1.0 Gameplay Trailer.    Obviously storage persistence and the loot economy cycle are not the same thing.  45-day storage persistence, imo, isn't necessary at all as a core element.  There's no reason it has to be a core gameplay feature.  Further, it probably shouldn't be trotted out as a core element if it's not working, which they did by selling the idea with the gameplay trailer.

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16 hours ago, drgullen said:

In the server files, the V3S is still set to not active, so it must not be ready yet.

Yea.  I know.  It's great that a person can loot all of these completely worthless items at launch.  Maybe they should have put m4a1 into the game but left out 5.56 ammo.  You know, in the same vein.   *shrug*

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10 minutes ago, Parazight said:

Sorry, I was just parroting the sage advice from the thread creator.  And no, this is an easy game.  At least surviving the elements is.  Other players is a whole other thing.  Definitely not a fair game though.  That's a good thing.

My point was that it shouldn't have been showcased in the 1.0 Gameplay Trailer.    Obviously storage persistence and the loot economy cycle are not the same thing.  45-day storage persistence, imo, isn't necessary at all as a core element.  There's no reason it has to be a core gameplay feature.  Further, it probably shouldn't be trotted out as a core element if it's not working, which they did by selling the idea with the gameplay trailer.

They're definitely not the same thing because the CLE manages everything. From items which should persist 45 days to items which should persist 30 minutes. It's the CLE which manages it and makes it happen. Every item in the game is handled by the CLE, wheter it's spawned or crafted. Since persistence isn't working correctly, this doesn't only mean that your camp or base will be gone because of a crash but every item in the world. You might be switching your backpack and stuff, server crashes, your stuff is gone. This happened friday to us when we were cooking some meat. My cooking pot, along with the fire and the meat on the ground all was gone when the server crashed. And mind you, we're talking about an official Experimental server, not a community server.

For 1.0, shit like this should not happen! Now it was a cooking pot but it might as well be half my stuff.

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54 minutes ago, IMT said:

For 1.0, shit like this should not happen! Now it was a cooking pot but it might as well be half my stuff.

"Shit like this should not happen" But it does.
Jeez - have you seen this planet? sometimes there are even air disasters, climate change, people die of food poisoning, and folk shoot each other.. wow, that shit shouldn't happen!
So what's your SOLUTION?
Maybe they should close down all the servers? Just STOP everyone playing altogether?

Or maybe - because you KNOW this will happen until it's FIXED (could take an hour or a week!) .. You could meantime maybe take a couple of days off?  OR write really a LOT complaints to fill up all your quality time until the problem is fixed. Or maybe - ya know - get some fresh air or something.. ?
I bet ya what you like THE DEVES ARE WORKING TO FIX THIS AND NOT DOING ANYTHING ELSE. -  And 100% I'll bet you KNOW that already.

Now - do have you a handy foolproof method of Changing the PAST?   Because If you do, tell the devs.
Then we'll ALL be happy.

.. aint that the truth.

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48 minutes ago, pilgrim* said:

"Shit like this should not happen" But it does.
Jeez - have you seen this planet? sometimes there are even air disasters, climate change, people die of food poisoning, and folk shoot each other.. wow, that shit shouldn't happen!
So what's your SOLUTION?
Maybe they should close down all the servers? Just STOP everyone playing altogether?

Or maybe - because you KNOW this will happen until it's FIXED (could take an hour or a week!) .. You could meantime maybe take a couple of days off?  OR write really a LOT complaints to fill up all your quality time until the problem is fixed. Or maybe - ya know - get some fresh air or something.. ?
I bet ya what you like THE DEVES ARE WORKING TO FIX THIS AND NOT DOING ANYTHING ELSE. -  And 100% I'll bet you KNOW that already.

Now - do have you a handy foolproof method of Changing the PAST?   Because If you do, tell the devs.
Then we'll ALL be happy.

.. aint that the truth.

Great comparison there, comparing (human) nature with a bug in a game, real smooth man. The solution is easy and that was to postpone 1.0 until it's fixed. I have the right to complain or criticise their decisions, since, you know, I'm a customer who payed for a product. You should try it sometime, it gives you more control over your life rather than to swallow everything which comes in your way.

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1 hour ago, pilgrim* said:

"Shit like this should not happen" But it does.
Jeez - have you seen this planet? sometimes there are even air disasters, climate change, people die of food poisoning, and folk shoot each other.. wow, that shit shouldn't happen!
So what's your SOLUTION?
Maybe they should close down all the servers? Just STOP everyone playing altogether?

Or maybe - because you KNOW this will happen until it's FIXED (could take an hour or a week!) .. You could meantime maybe take a couple of days off?  OR write really a LOT complaints to fill up all your quality time until the problem is fixed. Or maybe - ya know - get some fresh air or something.. ?
I bet ya what you like THE DEVES ARE WORKING TO FIX THIS AND NOT DOING ANYTHING ELSE. -  And 100% I'll bet you KNOW that already.

Now - do have you a handy foolproof method of Changing the PAST?   Because If you do, tell the devs.
Then we'll ALL be happy.

.. aint that the truth.

That's all a terrible excuse for allowing lacking quality, when people are posting constructive feedback based on the 1.0 release.

 

Yes, staff are working to fix bugs and issues, but more importantly - what are the team actually learning and taking on board as they go through releases riddled with issues and bugs? We seem to be in the same position every release, some bugs that reappear over time, which to me indicates that there is a lack of quality assurance before patches and releases are pushed out. What quality strategies do the team currently have, and what are you guys doing to improve your ways of working? I have yet to receive an official response from staff which contains more than just the "we take things very seriously" words, I like to see visuals - diagrams depicting the flow of work and where improvements are being made, it shows more effort and seriousness. Currently it just seems to be a group of developers working on something 'cool' and pushing patches out with no time spent on the development processes and lifecycle, while the rest of the company works on the much bigger picture with much richer and more mature ways of working.

 

This absolutely is not an insult, and do not take it that way, it is feedback from one developer who works in regulated environments, to another group of developers.

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3 hours ago, IMT said:

The solution is easy and that was to postpone 1.0 until it's fixed.

that didn't happen
what's the solution now ?

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2 hours ago, colinm9991 said:

I like to see visuals - diagrams depicting the flow of work and where improvements are being made,

Your company publish a lot of those, does it? .. Show us some of them please, right here on the blog. So we can learn from you.
(..yep, I'm betting you wont..)
Still, you must be Sooooo improved compared to how crap you were ?

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3 hours ago, IMT said:

I'm a customer who payed for a product. You should try it sometime, it gives you more control over your life rather than to swallow everything which comes in your way.

HaHA.. LOL

Did you REALLY just say that..??

sorry friend, no insult intended.. but .. "paying for a product gives you control over your life"..  ??.
I'm dropping out of the conversation, you just made my day.. that's enough of a laugh for tonight. You win hands down.

Have a good time, you hear?  Don't by too much product or you'll end up locked in mega-control of your life.  And THEN what might happen ?

 

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45 minutes ago, pilgrim* said:

Your company publish a lot of those, does it? .. Show us some of them please, right here on the blog. So we can learn from you.
(..yep, I'm betting you wont..)
Still, you must be Sooooo improved compared to how crap you were ?

Even though you are quite clearly a dedicated fan who is getting defensively offensive because you feel attacked, I'll entertain you nonetheless.

 

The companies I've worked for, and currently work for, actually do discuss with and present that process to customers (of which you are not). It's called being transparent and you taking offense to that just goes to show that you'd be quite happy with terrible customer support, completely illogical.

 

What do you do? Because if I'm correctly remembering, I am not asking you for transparency on how you're learning from bugs introduced, obviously you're quite happy to pay for a product not delivered as described, and the minimal customer interaction that comes with that.

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14 hours ago, colinm9991 said:

getting defensively offensive because you feel attacked..//..

just wanted to see your flowcharts, mate, to see how they helped the  process. 
xxP
 

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1 hour ago, pilgrim* said:

just wanted to see your flowcharts, mate, to see how they helped the  process. 
xxP
 

They haven't helped as much as copious amounts of coffee

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