Emotions! Make the game like in your TRAILER and like you told all the time.

[FluzooTV 1]

Greetings Guys,

I'm playing DayZ since the release of the Mod and I'm still playing the game (even the mod). I've spend a lot time in the game and I came over a problem that needs to be discussed and maybe solved.

DayZ is supposed to be a survival game in a zombie apocalyse. I guess everyone knows that. But why isn't the game like that? Everyone who plays the game knows that almost all interaction with other players is PvP. The rest of it mostly is a friendly interaction between players because noone of them has a weapon. Talking about zombies... Why are the zombies not the main-enemy in this game? For sure there are performance issues with a higher amount of zombies and I know the game is in early access. But maybe the developer should focus on a good combat system (maybe quicktime events) for fighting the zombies? The meele system sucks, we all know that as well. It's better than it was at the beginning but it still sucks. I'm feeling like playing one of this robo-arm games you remember from your childhood, when you tried to get this one teddybear. You keep getting him but somehow the arm never grabs the teddybear right. Thats the same thing with the meele system.

All in all I'm talking about making the game more immersive! Look at your trailer guys... nothing of the shown happens in the game. Only on Roleplayservers you can have some serious interactions but in the end it's the unicorn-version of dayz, because Shoot on Sight is a big part of the game - but it shouldnt be the main focus of the game (like it is right now). What I'm trying to say is, that the danger from every side is a big deal and that's what makes playing the game feeling good. But there is absolutely no reason for anyone to play with other people except of their friends.

So what is a possible solution for that?

The character shoul'nt be a empty hull without emotions. Just saying the players chooses what he is doing does not work anymore.
I'm talking about a system that simulates emotions of the character that is formed by the player itself. For example when a player kills another player for the first time (or even only see him) there should be something like a shock-moment. Give the player who killed the other one a disadvantage. For example if someone walks around alone all the time, he begins to hallucinate (seeing players or zombies where no zombies are for real). Only after some time he begins to handle the situation and the disadvantage fades. The more he kills other players the more he can handle the situation, up to a point where the player does'nt care at all.

Furthermore force players to play together. Noone in the real world would ever survive alone. Your mind would kill you slowly, because people need other humans to survive/to not become an idiot (ever saw Cast Away the movie?).

In the end you should make a system that does'nt kill the PvP at all but makes it more reasonable. The disadvantage you get should'nt force the players to be friendly all the time, but there has to be some reason play with other players at all. The system I'm talking about is not completely thought-out but it's a start for a real SIMULATION as you called it back then.

 

pps. 

I'm not bad in PvP at all so don't even try to flame me. I don't give a sh*t. 

[BeefBacon 1185]

No.

Working together is something that should be encouraged by game mechanics and the difficulty of the game, not the threat of hallucinations or some random debuff.

 DayZ isn't like the trailer for a couple of reasons. Firstly, the game isn't even finished yet, and probably won't be finished for quite some time. Current player interactions will likely change drastically over the course of development. Secondly, it's a trailer. Most game trailers are not exactly representative of the actual game. Hell, I design game trailers as a freelancer - the aim is to make the game look as good as possible and that often involves setting up a scenario that, odds are, you'll rarely, if ever, actually see play out in-game. This is especially true of multiplayer games. I mean, there could be a 30-minute uncut trailer of a player running across the map only for it to end in *CRACK* "You are dead" but that wouldn't be especially interesting. No doubt the devs want as many people to have that 'trailer experience' as possible, but that won't happen until the game is, you know, finished.

[FluzooTV 1]

Alright. Then let the "survival simulator" become the open world pvp game that it's supposed to be I guess.

Something has to be done. DayZ is already loosing players because of lack of progress in the development.

Furthermore there wont be any changes even if the game releases in 2072.

Quote

DayZ is a gritty, authentic, open-world survival horror hybrid-MMO game, in which players follow a single goal: to survive in the harsh post-apocalyptic landscape as long as they can. 

let me correct this (Steam Shop Site)

Quote

DayZ is a open world PvP Game.

 

 

You can not just hope that players will understand the sense of the survival aspect of the game. As you see the community is already toxic enought to kill everything they see with their sporter.

Edited May 28, 2016 by FluzooTV

[FluzooTV 1]

3 hours ago, BeefBacon said:

Working together is something that should be encouraged by game mechanics and the difficulty of the game, not the threat of hallucinations or some random debuff. 

Well.. it isnt at all. Solo Survival is a lot easier tbh. Theres absolutely no real reason to play in a group.

[Whyherro123 2283]

20 minutes ago, FluzooTV said:

Well.. it isnt at all. Solo Survival is a lot easier tbh. Theres absolutely no real reason to play in a group.

Because the game isn't finished yet, you numbskull. There are barely any actual survival mechanics in the game yet

Believe me, when loot gets more scarce, there are more zombies on the map, and the environment becomes an actual threat, you are probably gong to want to group up with players..

But not yet, because all that isn't in-game yet

[FluzooTV 1]

4 hours ago, Whyherro123 said:

Because the game isn't finished yet, you numbskull. There are barely any actual survival mechanics in the game yet

Believe me, when loot gets more scarce, there are more zombies on the map, and the environment becomes an actual threat, you are probably gong to want to group up with players..

But not yet, because all that isn't in-game yet

There won't change anything in this direction.

Thanks for insulting me, you're apparently not able to discuss a simple topic.

Sad... Sad...

[Parazight 1594]

17 minutes ago, FluzooTV said:

Blah x100

Sad... Sad...

Try to not to base reality and expectations on advertising.   Lol  

It's melee, not 'meele'.  

There is nothing wrong with Whyherro's discussion. Maybe you are just unable to accept it because you don't agree with it?

Emotions are terrible as game mechanics, I don't even know where to start attacking that debate, so many angles.  

You say that you're not bad at pvp, but go on blathering about how solo is easier.  I smell bullshit.

 

 

[The Ghost of Hoik 92]

This is my solution (if you have some time to kill) >

I posted them years ago (in my former life :P) and with the new central loot economy and the zombie spawning mechanisms it is completely viable (hello modding?). I agree that there is some vital things missing from dayz - because it is not even close to finished. 

[IkaikaKekai 1957]

There's a trailer for the game? *checks steam* Ah...so there is.

I don't get where you're thinking that the Devs want to force us to work together and be one happy camp during the zombie apoc.  They've said repeatedly they're not going to enforce one playstyle over another.  Adding emotions as you suggest would do that.  Not only that but the hallucinations where a player would see other players where there aren't doesn't sound doable.  Not only that but it won't stop anything, PVPers will PVP whenever they get the chance.  It's why they play games where PVP is an option or the only way, it'll be more of an annoyance than a guiding hand.  "Aw fuck, I'm hallucinating again, who has some pills?  No one?  Fuck, okay someone grab my gear and meet me at the beach." /killself.

It's forcing something to happen in a open game.  IF DayZ was a single player RPG and we play as Demitri Zangonov, a Cherno-American Highschool Guidance Consoler visiting his relatives in the old country when shit hits the fan, I could possibly see forced emotions as we hold a gun on a survivor for their can of beans, I could see him having PTSD or survivor's guilt from that.  It's not that though, it's a game with many different players with different mindsets thrown into a world with no rules and dangers at every turn.  I myself would have trouble shooting people in cold blood who don't pose an active threat to me.  Other people on the other hand are FUCKING PSYCOPATHS who kill for sport, they're not shootng you because you might have the last can of beans in existence and they don't want to find out if you're willing to share or not, they want to kill you fto kill you.  Making people 'feel bad' isn't going to stop them from KOSing, otherwise they wouldn't have done it in the first place.

And how would you handle a situation where a lone player out scavenging a city, sees a group of heavily armed players start executing unarmed players with a chainsaw just for the Lulz, then opens fire from his concealed position to take care of a threat?  "Well I'll just make it so that if someone kills someone who killed someone they don't 'feel bad'."  Apart from that being diffcult to program, what about when one of the psychos shoots the hero who just took down the rest of his squad?

Right now there's almost literally nothing to do other than gear up and hunt people.  Zombies (as of .59) are more of a nussance than a threat, food, ammo, supplies, and guns are easy to come by for the moment, and that's because we are TESTING things.  If everything spawned at the levels the Devs want at release, it'd be hard to find bugs with new features or find bugs at all.  IE if having an RDS on a M4 crashes the game when there's less than 10 rounds of ammo in Magpul magazines, with a prestine buttstock it'd be damn near impossible to tell because no one can survive long enough to get all those things together.

[veshcula 13]

16 hours ago, FluzooTV said:

Alright. Then let the "survival simulator" become the open world pvp game that it's supposed to be I guess.

Something has to be done. DayZ is already loosing players because of lack of progress in the development.

Furthermore there wont be any changes even if the game releases in 2072.

let me correct this (Steam Shop Site)

You can not just hope that players will understand the sense of the survival aspect of the game. As you see the community is already toxic enought to kill everything they see with their sporter.

that is... until the devs figure out a way to quadruple the amount of zeds in cities in general... like it should be.. if you have a country the size of chernarus.. and as remote as chernarus (up north and west) not every person in this country would be airlifted to safety.. since that wouldn't be realistic.

dayz STOPS being a PVP game and will focus more on survival when SHTF.. and instead of 10 zombies on NWA.. there are now 40 or more zombies.. 
once it becomes dangerous enough (zombies/predators/other players) the KoS/this is a COD FPS game mentality will stop on its own..
because by then, the FIRST person to fire his SKS or sporter in cherno after spotting a fresh spawn.. will have to RUN like a bat outta hell.. since he aggro's the entire zombie pop of cherno on his ass.. trying to eat that person
because you've effectively rung the dinner bell.. 

if the devs can get people to stop KoS and shoot about for shits and giggles (like dean hall wanted from the very start!) slow down the game speed/make it MORE dangerous to go places/make sure Chernarus is a REAL dangerous place..
by that time.. it SHOULD force people to work together.. trying to survive.. instead of playing 'pick off the freshy' on the coast.. because that gets you killed when you're a lone wolf

if not by other players, than by zeds.. if not by neither of those.. you're getting mauled to death by wolves or bears etc.

see you in cherno folks.. be safe

[Xbow 362]

On 5/28/2016 at 6:19 AM, BeefBacon said:

No.

Working together is something that should be encouraged by game mechanics and the difficulty of the game, not the threat of hallucinations or some random debuff.

 

I AGREE 100%  I don't need or want some block of code telling me when I am bored, exhilarated, afraid, lonely, or paranoid. The game itself will stimulate such emotions in US the players when the real time situation dictates it. If you suddenly find yourself getting sniped at from an unknown assailant while you are capping zombies and have been hit by a few zombie swipes and are losing blood and need to bandage you will genuinely feel fear, exhilaration, and perhaps paranoia. This especially true if you have kept your alter-ego alive for a long while and are well equipped. We don't need artificiality injected into the game because that inhibits immersion and destroys the gaming experience.

I prefer operating alone because it seems that most of the time when I desire to connect and befriend other players I get shot at or otherwise attacked. For a long time I have traveled with my weapon at the ready and when I encounter other players I will either 1) open fire immediately or 2)get the hell out of dodge. I most often choose option #2. I have no need or desire to shoot someone to get their gear or rack up another notch on my gun. What I do like doing is detecting other players and tracking and observing them while I remain unseen and undetected.                

Edited May 29, 2016 by Xbow

[Troll_Hunter 54]

I think there are still a lot of technical improvements to be done, a features to be developed.

For instance the up and coming new player controller. This will hopefully make the animations and hand to hand combat smooth, enhancing the interaction experience.

When the environment becomes a bigger thread, bears, wolves, bores etc, people will find that working together increases their opportunities to visit more dangerous spots.

With the addition of base building and complex vehicles creative types will have a better outlet of their creativity.

Weight carry limitations will make working together, sharing the load, more beneficial.

You see there are a lot of variables that need to be tested and tuned to get an interesting player mix, that yields interesting interactions and stories.

[quatermass 9]

The only way to stop 'Shoot on Sight' is to give the potential shooter something to their advantage.

Sure let shooters be able to kill players, but if they can choose to wound players, then they could perhaps decide not to kill?

I suggest that players can collect skills by performing tasks or finding books. Their benefit is they do the skill faster over time if if they repeat common actions. Like Apple picking or they get less disease if repeatingly drinking pond water, or opening tins with a knife gets easier are but 3 simple examples. These skills would be passed on to the villain if they capture the player alive and have to 'interrogate' them over a period of time. Then the player has to choose to manually pass them on at their convenience in return for their release?

Veteran players with high skills would be valued for team work and they could use skills for bartering goods?

 

[wander76 1]

Zombies must be real and permanent main threat in the game. It will solve all problems with PVP.

Like in the game Project Zomboid. There are plenty of zombies at all and to survive you must be very stealthy. Besides that there is an interesting script. When the player stays in one place, after some time there appears a sound of helicopter fly around and hordes of zombies begin throng to the player position. In that situation player has only two choices - run or make friends with any other players to build defences and fight off zombies.

Similar system is in the game State of Decay.

Zombie must be real and permanent main threat and any player will just has not time for PVP.

To be a real threat zombie must be faster than player, must be killed headshot only, must be very sensitive to sounds of shots and quickly gather to the shooter (doesn't matter it's a shooter in the city or sniper in the forest).

I don't know about the future but at the moment (0.59) I can gather horde of 20-30 zombies (it's hard enough, there are not so many even in Cherno and Electro) and bring them from Cherno to NWA.

I made it couple of times and I was killed on the airfield by other players not by zombies. I drived 20 zombies over all Chernarus's map and they were not a threat for me and players that joined to me on the way.

All my states is only IMHO.

But at the moment in the game there is PVP because player (who has hi loot and lay on the hill with sniper rifle) doesn't have to worry about his life every minutes.

He doesn't have to worry his shot can hear zombies (in the forest there are no zombies at all, but even through they are there, there are not many of them and they are not a problem even for one player).

Very strong, dangerous zombies is a real reason to play in a group.

IMHO

Sorry for my bad English.

P.S. About PVP skill. Doesn't matter how good you are in PVP.

One lucky noob with sniper rifle on the hill can kill you with one lucky shot when you just will go pass. Because he knows he can shoot with impunity and in the game zombies are not threat at all.

Hope, in the future there will be hundreds of zombies for one noisy player in the game.

And they'll be very fast and sensitive.

[Parazight 1594]

32 minutes ago, wander76 said:

Zombies must be real and permanent main threat in the game. It will solve all problems with PVP.

 

The only real threat is other players.  In the past, present, and future.  Across all MMOs. 

NPCs will always be predictable.  The infected were only ever meant to enhance the environment. This is widely accepted fact.  Zombies will never deter KOS.

Good luck out there

Edited June 8, 2016 by Parazight

[wander76 1]

May be bad AI quality could be replaced by quantity.

When I drove about 20 zombies to NWA military base, there were 2 players (and 3 dead bodies). When one of them started shoot at me, zombies began to gather at him. After couple of minutes he was unconscious. I could loot other bodies silently while zombies finished off the shooter.

Conclusion: even now zombies can be dangerous.  All is needed - raise the quantity of zombies. From my experience I think 20-30 zombies for one shooter enough to make him think twice before shooting next time.

And they must always be near the player (city or forest doesn't matter). If AI quality not good then zombies must respawn around every player like in Dayz mod.

I agree - KOS always be in game, while game gives player free minutes for KOS.

Edited June 8, 2016 by wander76

[wander76 1]

On 28.05.2016 at 8:08 PM, Whyherro123 said:

Believe me, when loot gets more scarce, there are more zombies on the map, and the environment becomes an actual threat, you are probably gong to want to group up with players..

 

Agree.

Did you see "Days Gone" Gameplay Demo (E3 2016)?
There are real dangerous zombies.
When zombies just like these will be in Dayz it will resolve any problem with PVP.

With zombies like these Dayz may become a real survival game.
Absolutely new gameplay may appear.

Any new player after respawn will be seeking refuge from hordes of zombies all around.
And old player will be glad to have any new player which will help to protect his base from hordes of zombies.

There will be much more reasons to play in a group than play KOS.