Dealing with the frustration

[S3V3N 1402]

This was actually my reply to a thread that has now been closed, but hopefully you find something true in there for you. I'm not a fanboy or yay-sayer. I'm a supporter of the game, and find myself facing frustration about the development at every wait for a patch. I might tell myself to get a life. Yet, for those of us, who also take gaming way too seriously, here is a breakdown of how I'm being split-minded but hopeful for Dayz's future:

Probably the only thing I can add to it is to think of a studio like Bohemia as a family and a studio like ~ Ubisoft as something like a factory. There are people who like working in a factory. There are 3D modelers (in the car industry) that just do lights or doors all day. And they know every nook and cranny about their CAD-work. For the outsider and creative artist this is totally boring, yet it is specialised work as part of a bigger workflow. In game development we often see similar facilitators to the workflow.

Bohemia doesn't have that workflow much. It seems even most models they buy from freelancers. There is no concept artist at the start, then a modeler, then a skinner and texture artist; in Bohemia's philosophy one artist does it all. It's pretty oldschool, if you want so. But it isn't efficient on huge projects; this also explains why some of the older rifle models look like someone went over every edge with a piece of sandpaper, while in the newer models damage is balanced and in the right places. To have consistency in an artist-orientated work-flow is difficult; what if the artist gets ill, or doesn't do freelance any more? Then you get someone else and his models/textures look different...Imagine what would happen, if Dayz's main coder went away; he's probably the only one who knows the engine front to back, even though there are probably several coders. 

The good thing is this is not a problem with Dayz, because let's face it: all the models and art are generic and can be created from Photo-Reference. It's not an "artistic" game at all, which is why a factory-approach would really speed things up for Dayz. However, they are family and want to work like that. They let everyone be an artist, even though they are probably cursing about work and pay half the time. Despite all the rage, Dayz's community allows for artistry and is patient. Pull that stunt with, e.g. GTA and try saying: "yeah maybe next year we'll release" and you'll have a s h i t s t o r m. (I think something like that happened and there was an outrage over a few weeks delay).

---

Dayz will never be as successfull as GTA or Just Cause. It could have been though, but the way it is produced that's simply not an option. That's a disadvantage for Bohemia, and a slight disadvantage for us. Because we have to wait longer, but we get a game that came together through a concerted effort of artists, instead of a collaboration of executives. The artist is more valuable here than in a normal game development. The individual counts, the community counts. Would you even know who modeled a weapon for GTA? Would you care? It's a different thing altogether.

The more I think about it the more I believe we should thank the devs for not throwing the game to the wolves, early on. They could have milked the hype. We could easily be playing a mod ripoff with 3 DLC packs and pay-to-win perks by now. Someone didn't let that happen! (probably have to thank Mark Spanel for believing in Rocket's vision).

The problem I have - is that often it doesn't feel like they are giving it all. I don't expect them to bleed out over this, but sometimes I wonder, if tasks couldn't be done a wee bit faster. It sucks knowing all those features and waiting, waiting for them. I appreciate the devs are visiting the forums more, but I also think they should not get too emotionally invested over the comments. Of course we feel let down or plain bad when the patch of all patches turns out to be just another delay. That shit is called reality. You can spoon it out of the way 24/7 and that still won't make the game happen any faster; rather the opposite. It would be awesome if at some point they announce something and the next week it happens. I don't want to learn about features anymore when they are months away from becoming a part of the game. 

Edited March 24, 2016 by S3V3N

[rafap 9]

The problem of the game is that the developers the very initially miscalculated I bought the game early 2015 reading on DayZ official webiste, the beta version will be in Q4 2015 http://www.dayztv.com/standalone/dayz-2015-roadmap/ and the full version of the game at the beginning of 2016.I was hoping that I will play a few months in alpha then the new year will play in the full version. Now we have the end of March 2016, it turns out that the game is not even half the time to Beta I understand those who defend DayZ team that continues further work and everything but we need not declare the bete at the end of 2015 years making people chaff from the brain. I myself am a little disappointed because the game I drive a year and three months and still play in the same game in which bugged a lot of really important things so far not changed. The most important I mean the optimization of the game, a better performance in big cities where FPS with very good computer falling to levels not playable, Or simply the many crashes of the game is stupid jams especially during the action and shooting. I give a shit, they added the weight of unnecessary crap like new weapons when you have not fixed the major bugs game and at times created new problems It was enough to say at once that we do not know when they created the game work and whether it will be a year or five years we do not know this to be seen and not what the show Roadmap then people with candles in their eyes pounce buy Alpha and great disappointment, that there is still no what announced for the year.

Currently I am waiting for a new update and see what we can, but I'm afraid that it was not so that people will start to test new optimization that will require another 10 to update and only take care of something else.

[Tigermonk 140]

45 minutes ago, rafap said:

The problem of the game is that the developers the very initially miscalculated I bought the game early 2015 reading on DayZ official webiste, the beta version will be in Q4 2015 http://www.dayztv.com/standalone/dayz-2015-roadmap/ and the full version of the game at the beginning of 2016.I was hoping that I will play a few months in alpha then the new year will play in the full version. Now we have the end of March 2016, it turns out that the game is not even half the time to Beta I understand those who defend DayZ team that continues further work and everything but we need not declare the bete at the end of 2015 years making people chaff from the brain. I myself am a little disappointed because the game I drive a year and three months and still play in the same game in which bugged a lot of really important things so far not changed. The most important I mean the optimization of the game, a better performance in big cities where FPS with very good computer falling to levels not playable, Or simply the many crashes of the game is stupid jams especially during the action and shooting. I give a shit, they added the weight of unnecessary crap like new weapons when you have not fixed the major bugs game and at times created new problems It was enough to say at once that we do not know when they created the game work and whether it will be a year or five years we do not know this to be seen and not what the show Roadmap then people with candles in their eyes pounce buy Alpha and great disappointment, that there is still no what announced for the year.

Currently I am waiting for a new update and see what we can, but I'm afraid that it was not so that people will start to test new optimization that will require another 10 to update and only take care of something else.

 

1 hour ago, S3V3N said:

This was actually my reply to a thread that has now been closed, but hopefully you find something true in there for you. I'm not a fanboy or yay-sayer. I'm a supporter of the game, and find myself facing frustration about the development at every wait for a patch. I might tell myself to get a life. Yet, for those of us, who also take gaming way too seriously, here is a breakdown of how I'm being split-minded but hopeful for Dayz's future:

Probably the only thing I can add to it is to think of a studio like Bohemia as a family and a studio like ~ Ubisoft as something like a factory. There are people who like working in a factory. There are 3D modelers (in the car industry) that just do lights or doors all day. And they know every nook and cranny about their CAD-work. For the outsider and creative artist this is totally boring, yet it is specialised work as part of a bigger workflow. In game development we often see similar facilitators to the workflow.

Bohemia doesn't have that workflow much. It seems even most models they buy from freelancers. There is no concept artist at the start, then a modeler, then a skinner and texture artist; in Bohemia's philosophy one artist does it all. It's pretty oldschool, if you want so. But it isn't efficient on huge projects; this also explains why some of the older rifle models look like someone went over every edge with a piece of sandpaper, while in the newer models damage is balanced and in the right places. To have consistency in an artist-orientated work-flow is difficult; what if the artist gets ill, or doesn't do freelance any more? Then you get someone else and his models/textures look different...Imagine what would happen, if Dayz's main coder went away; he's probably the only one who knows the engine front to back, even though there are probably several coders. 

The good thing is this is not a problem with Dayz, because let's face it: all the models and art are generic and can be created from Photo-Reference. It's not an "artistic" game at all, which is why a factory-approach would really speed things up for Dayz. However, they are family and want to work like that. They let everyone be an artist, even though they are probably cursing about work and pay half the time. Despite all the rage, Dayz's community allows for artistry and is patient. Pull that stunt with, e.g. GTA and try saying: "yeah maybe next year we'll release" and you'll have a s h i t s t o r m. (I think something like that happened and there was an outrage over a few weeks delay).

---

Dayz will never be as successfull as GTA or Just Cause. It could have been though, but the way it is produced that's simply not an option. That's a disadvantage for Bohemia, and a slight disadvantage for us. Because we have to wait longer, but we get a game that came together through a concerted effort of artists, instead of a collaboration of executives. The artist is more valuable here than in a normal game development. The individual counts, the community counts. Would you even know who modeled a weapon for GTA? Would you care? It's a different thing altogether.

The more I think about it the more I believe we should thank the devs for not throwing the game to the wolves, early on. They could have milked the hype. We could easily be playing a mod ripoff with 3 DLC packs and pay-to-win perks by now. Someone didn't let that happen! (probably have to thank Mark Spanel for believing in Rocket's vision).

The problem I have - is that often it doesn't feel like they are giving it all. I don't expect them to bleed out over this, but sometimes I wonder, if tasks couldn't be done a wee bit faster. It sucks knowing all those features and waiting, waiting for them. I appreciate the devs are visiting the forums more, but I also think they should not get too emotionally invested over the comments. Of course we feel let down or plain bad when the patch of all patches turns out to be just another delay. That shit is called reality. You can spoon it out of the way 24/7 and that still won't make the game happen any faster; rather the opposite. It would be awesome if at some point they announce something and the next week it happens. I don't want to learn about features anymore when they are months away from becoming a part of the game. 

these 2 comments pretty much sum up my frustrations.. and what i've been trying to explain on this forum for the last month or so :) 

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

You'll forget you ever started this thread a year from now S3V3N.

All concerns will either be allayed or confirmed in time.

The more you emotionally detach from this project the easier it is to gain this perspective.

Desire is the root of all suffering my son.....

[SMoss 2101]

2 hours ago, S3V3N said:

The problem I have - is that often it doesn't feel like they are giving it all. I don't expect them to bleed out over this, but sometimes I wonder, if tasks couldn't be done a wee bit faster. It sucks knowing all those features and waiting, waiting for them. I appreciate the devs are visiting the forums more, but I also think they should not get too emotionally invested over the comments. Of course we feel let down or plain bad when the patch of all patches turns out to be just another delay. That shit is called reality. You can spoon it out of the way 24/7 and that still won't make the game happen any faster; rather the opposite. It would be awesome if at some point they announce something and the next week it happens. I don't want to learn about features anymore when they are months away from becoming a part of the game. 

Nobody is holding back on development here. As fast as tasks can be knocked off the check list, they will be. It's understandable that delays are not going to sit right with just about anyone, but I hope that you'll believe me when I say that estimations are done with the info we have at hand. What we don't have readily at hand when giving out an estimation is test data for example. Noone deliberately gives out bogus estimates on any work tasks or releases.

[pilgrim* 3513]

                                                       :)      IS NOT PROBLEM   (no stress)

 

Edited March 24, 2016 by pilgrim*

[c4p 30]

I see your point @S3V3N, and I can understand it, but we know there are reasons, why it is, like it is.
Yes, the devs could communicate more, which happens right now, with e.g. Mr.Hicks's last post, but this costs money and more important, time.

I often read, that people are saying: "Look at Star Citizen, they have weekly reports and more. Why can't the Dayz devs do the same?"
Simple, because the subscribers are paying for this informations - thousands of people 10$ or 20$ every month, over years!
The smallest package was sold for 30$ in 2012/2013, now you have to pay 60$ to get the full game (SP+MP).
I bought Dayz for ~24€...SC ~150€!! Every backer paid an average price of ~80$ - two different worlds.
Sure the Dayz devs would release weekly Status Reports and what-not, when we would pay 10$/20$ per month. We don't have such a system and if they would implement it now, then...you can imagine it by yourself.

Both games have big communities, both games will be in development for a long time. Both games have a huge scope, with new/heavily modified engines, things they have maybe never done before.  
What I want to say, things will be delayed, broken, unfinished until it's fixed and finally implemented.

Furthermore the games became bigger and bigger with every sold unit. We know what was planned at first and what they will deliver later. That's different as night and day.
We know what they said about the previous documentation - it was awful and they want to do it better! And that takes the most time imo. They learned from their mistakes in the past and this will also be good for both sides, the devs and us players. In the future, when they will release new games/IPs/what-ever they can work faster and show things better to new employees.
We also know this engine will be the future-enigne of Bohemia, I'm sure we will see ARMA4 with it, because the improvements should be huge. (Love A3 tho, no need for A4 the next 2-3years^^)

At the end I believe, if the devs weren't bashed the last two years, we could see the new tech earlier. Now they want it as good/bugfree/smooth as possible at the first public release, maybe I'm wrong according to @SMoss.  

DayZ will be released, it will be the product which we want, but it takes time, longer than expected - we sit all in the same boat, course set to the coast of Chernarus :-) On day, we are there!

[philbur 476]

4 hours ago, c4p said:

We also know this engine will be the future-enigne of Bohemia, I'm sure we will see ARMA4 with it, because the improvements should be huge. (Love A3 tho, no need for A4 the next 2-3years^^)

 

Is this true?

I honestly had no clue that the new engine being created for Day SA was already expected to be something Bohemia was going to use in-house for future projects.

Seriously guys...not being sarcastic (for a change)...I guess I never considered the DayZ SA team as being part of the larger picture yet and I "thought" the IP from DayZ SA was going to be more or less "up for consideration" once the project was ready to be officially labelled a BI game. I thought that BI was keeping an arms length from SA until there was definitive progress towards 1.0 and I used the fact that BI's website has no mention of it in their game listings as justification for this.

Weird... I would post a reply to this post of mine with a big-ass dunce cap on my avatar if I knew BoneBoys wouldn't whack me for self-Beaning! ;-P

That does indeed give me reason to feel a better about all this hubbub and twaddle!

[philbur 476]

5 hours ago, SMoss said:

Nobody is holding back on development here. As fast as tasks can be knocked off the check list, they will be. It's understandable that delays are not going to sit right with just about anyone, but I hope that you'll believe me when I say that estimations are done with the info we have at hand. What we don't have readily at hand when giving out an estimation is test data for example. Noone deliberately gives out bogus estimates on any work tasks or releases.

Thanks, and respect for chiming in, my man.

You should rest assured that most of the dedicated players here sympathize with you and the real pain is felt only when "someone" makes that one little error of announcing new features/content/enhancements to the world and attaches even a vague timeline to when we will get to mess with it. S3V3N has point on this one, and I think you can agree that most of the times "we" get really annoying are the periods after a suggested release gets delayed extra long...without follow up information.

Take as long as you guys need to....but throw us a bone or two when the builds don't test out.... I am personally just as interested in your delays as I am in your new content because that's one of the main reasons I chose to jump into the Alpha!

Learning about just how complex and interconnected all the different processes are and how your team functions in relation to moving from one aspect of the dev cycle to another... You might just as well add "Game Engine Developer Spectator Simulator" to the project for now as my admission price seems like a bargain when I look at it that way and I appreciate it every time I learn something new from this.

[ColdAtrophy 1850]

You know how I deal with delays like these? Steam sales. I've bought 4 cheap, awesome games since the beginning of the year and haven't touched DayZ in quite a few weeks. You absolutely positively must know when it's time to break away from this project and go do other stuff or you risk feeling disillusioned and getting frustrated. When .60 comes out, I will come back. The delays ARE absolutely insane. I agree. The first estimate for .60 was for a pre-Christmas release. Getting bitter or upset about it changes nothing, but your own feeling of happiness. Not worth it. Just my two cents.

[byrgesen 1340]

17 hours ago, philbur said:

Is this true?

I honestly had no clue that the new engine being created for Day SA was already expected to be something Bohemia was going to use in-house for future projects.

Seriously guys...not being sarcastic (for a change)...I guess I never considered the DayZ SA team as being part of the larger picture yet and I "thought" the IP from DayZ SA was going to be more or less "up for consideration" once the project was ready to be officially labelled a BI game. I thought that BI was keeping an arms length from SA until there was definitive progress towards 1.0 and I used the fact that BI's website has no mention of it in their game listings as justification for this.

Weird... I would post a reply to this post of mine with a big-ass dunce cap on my avatar if I knew BoneBoys wouldn't whack me for self-Beaning! ;-P

That does indeed give me reason to feel a better about all this hubbub and twaddle!

Nobody creates a "new engine" and just use if for a single game, especially when its an engine as complex as this.
Thats why we have 1000 different versions of Unreal Engine, Source Engine, Crytek Engine, Frostbite Engine and even the famous (infamous?) Real Virtuality Engine, from which Enfusion is being created (forked).

I personally had to step away from DayZ development and only casually follow it. I made the mistake in the mod of over-playing the game, over-following the development and thinking it would be done in a year or so, oh how i have become wiser now lol... This made me kinda hate the mod in the end, what a shame, because i got so many hours of absolute fun in it!
I dont wanna make that mistake with DayZ SA, simply because i expect it to become so much more then the mod ever was, and i dont wanna get sick of it before even playing the final game. So i find other stuff to do and only boot up the game for some hours at each stable patch, just to feel the improvements.

 

If you play this game every day and you follow development intenstly, you are most likely gonne end up hating the game when it comes out, simply because of the unrealistic expectations you have set for it, to begin with.

However, like you mention, Bohemia is not know for making games because they want huge profits. They are known for making games, that they themselves love to play. Theres countless examples from the Arma-verse and Take On Mars, of player suggested ideas that never made it into the game, because the developers didnt like it.
That, in it self, is not really a good thing, but combine it with a company that knows what they are doing and are producing games for a niche part of the gaming market, you usually end up with a brilliant product.

I for one cant mention a Bohemia game i didnt like at launch, they are all pretty fantastic, in theyre own way.

So im thankfull a company like bohemia is spearheading DayZ. Had it been Ubisoft or one of the developers under EA publishing (mainstream examples), we would have gotten the full release all ready and about 500 DLC's down the road, with content that should actually be in the core game to begin with.

Edited March 25, 2016 by byrgesen

[Heatofbattle 49]

On 3/24/2016 at 11:55 AM, ☣BioHaze☣ said:

You'll forget you ever started this thread a year from now S3V3N.

All concerns will either be allayed or confirmed in time.

The more you emotionally detach from this project the easier it is to gain this perspective.

Desire is the root of all suffering my son.....

Delusional. Bohemia will likely move the rest of the dayz team to make new Arma 3 content, will end up like every other Early Access game.

[ColdAtrophy 1850]

25 minutes ago, Heatofbattle said:

Delusional. Bohemia will likely move the rest of the dayz team to make new Arma 3 content, will end up like every other Early Access game.

Yeah, I mean, why wouldn't they throw away the single most popular and most potentially profitable IP they've ever owned? 

If they actually did as you suggest, they'd never be able to sell anybody a damn thing ever again.

Edited March 25, 2016 by ColdAtrophy

[[Gen]Adzic 241]

I guess we just want the game to be good, of course with the inclusion of what gives the Day its Z.. actual scary, life threatening, preferably non-bug ridden, flesh eating, Zombies.. and to be quite frank for these past few years it's just not been very good.

 

I'm probably now the wrong kind of customer your looking for. You need them overly patient, forever optimist types and thankfully I've spied there are plenty.

 

 

 

Edited March 25, 2016 by [Gen]Adzic

[☣BioHaze☣ 7337]

1 hour ago, Heatofbattle said:

Delusional. Bohemia will likely move the rest of the dayz team to make new Arma 3 content, will end up like every other Early Access game.

You're free to flee this so called sinking ship anytime you like, chummmmm -*p*.

[S3V3N 1402]

Well, this thread brought out the good in people didn't it? I'm kinda happy someone closed the other "rage" thread, where I wanted to post it. The thing about forum rage is: it is so tempting, but it only vents our anger for a brief time; and that anger is usually just frustration. This is much better! We hear more about concerns here, and I find that I can understand other people's position better. Dayz could be made a textbook example of how a conversion mod-game is more problematic than starting from scratch. The reasons Dayz went into Alpha-funding are probably varied: to stay ahead of the (free) mod competition, to release a new standalone game, to use the hype to get funded...

There are pretty plenty of good and not so good reasons why Dayz was put into Alpha-funding, but it wasn't the way to go with this project. It seems awesome at first glance - this contracted bond between gamer and developer. The closeness and involvement with development we have. But fact is - even normal game developments don't run so smoothly. And gamers don't understand that and don't want to know or hear about it. Looking for bugs in a game is a tedious and time-consuming process. The process Dayz is going through seems twofold. For one they have to deal with problems in Arma's legacy code, for two they have to make the old systems work with new ones and replace what they can of the old. There is just something begging to go wrong. And then there is usually a long problem of elemination: is the error in the code, is it in the model, in the folder-structure, or the AI-instructions? The thing we often believe is that computer programs and systems are stable. Because that's what the consumer end looks like and aims for. Yet, in development, there can be moments where the software cocks up. This can happen even, if on the paper things work out. There is a bit more character in advanced 3D software than most developers would wish for. That's why big developers love their annual franchises, where they know things will work as anticipated. When Assassin's Creed switched to Unreal Engine 4, they had quite a few problems and created one of the weaker games. Now they have it under control and are back to old standards (which still isn't very high, just highly polished). So this happens to everyone, except these huge games are on a tight budget with hundreds of developers and can't take much risk.

Dayz takes a risk with its development. It wants to get features right, instead of just getting them in. That is the theory. The renderer is one of those features. In practice we've seen lots of placeholders so far and are waiting for the "right" things to get in. That concerns almost every aspect of the game and those systems, which have been renewed (like the vehicles) are still heavily under construction. And since all these features seem to hinge on the success of the renderer, we don't feel reassured when things like that get delayed. In theory, Dayz's development is excellent - except in reality it isn't. And like I wrote, there are many reasons and possible causes for this. It's collateral in the creation process of a game. But I really do hope the devs take that challenge to heart. They have come this far and completed the one main feature that carries the rest. Now should be the time to hammer away at it and set the development on fire. We all deserve this to end well! Perhaps April will help with regaining strength and motivation. April is the new intern ;)

Edited March 26, 2016 by S3V3N

[Tigermonk 140]

6 hours ago, S3V3N said:

Well, this thread brought out the good in people didn't it? I'm kinda happy someone closed the other "rage" thread, where I wanted to post it. The thing about forum rage is: it is so tempting, but it only vents our anger for a brief time; and that anger is usually just frustration. This is much better! We hear more about concerns here, and I find that I can understand other people's position better. Dayz could be made a textbook example of how a conversion mod-game is more problematic than starting from scratch. The reasons Dayz went into Alpha-funding are probably varied: to stay ahead of the (free) mod competition, to release a new standalone game, to use the hype to get funded...

There are pretty plenty of good and not so good reasons why Dayz was put into Alpha-funding, but it wasn't the way to go with this project. It seems awesome at first glance - this contracted bond between gamer and developer. The closeness and involvement with development we have. But fact is - even normal game developments don't run so smoothly. And gamers don't understand that and don't want to know or hear about it. Looking for bugs in a game is a tedious and time-consuming process. The process Dayz is going through seems twofold. For one they have to deal with problems in Arma's legacy code, for two they have to make the old systems work with new ones and replace what they can of the old. There is just something begging to go wrong. And then there is usually a long problem of elemination: is the error in the code, is it in the model, in the folder-structure, or the AI-instructions? The thing we often believe is that computer programs and systems are stable. Because that's what the consumer end looks like and aims for. Yet, in development, there can be moments where the software cocks up. This can happen even, if on the paper things work out. There is a bit more character in advanced 3D software than most developers would wish for. That's why big developers love their annual franchises, where they know things will work as anticipated. When Assassin's Creed switched to Unreal Engine 4, they had quite a few problems and created one of the weaker games. Now they have it under control and are back to old standards (which still isn't very high, just highly polished). So this happens to everyone, except these huge games are on a tight budget with hundreds of developers and can't take much risk.

Dayz takes a risk with its development. It wants to get features right, instead of just getting them in. That is the theory. The renderer is one of those features. In practice we've seen lots of placeholders so far and are waiting for the "right" things to get in. That concerns almost every aspect of the game and those systems, which have been renewed (like the vehicles) are still heavily under construction. And since all these features seem to hinge on the success of the renderer, we don't feel reassured when things like that get delayed. In theory, Dayz's development is excellent - except in reality it isn't. And like I wrote, there are many reasons and possible causes for this. It's collateral in the creation process of a game. But I really do hope the devs take that challenge to heart. They have come this far and completed the one main feature that carries the rest. Now should be the time to hammer away at it and set the development on fire. We all deserve this to end well! Perhaps April will help with regaining strength and motivation. April is the new intern ;)

like s3v3n explains in the thread above. let's hope april is the new beginning for us all... including the devs.. put some renewed fire in the work ethic. so in turn.. we'll hopefully have more results and a little less 'we think/maybe' that would do a lot of people in the community very good including myself :) no more 'long' term lists that end up with 8-10 months delay.. because it's 'written' thus visible to everything and everyone. just a solid stream of step by step, point by point progress that we can all enjoy ;)

[philbur 476]

Let the love back in, everyone!

April might be the revelation we are all hoping for indeed!

Already we have a reply from SMOSS in this thread and Brian actually spoke up in another thread last week...seems like it's up to us to put all that unhealthy negativity behind us for a while and just go for it as well.

I resolve to do my part and help breath some much-needed enthusiasm back into this Forum.

And Happy Easter to all!

[Hicks_206 (DayZ) 4297]

9 hours ago, S3V3N said:

Well, this thread brought out the good in people didn't it? I'm kinda happy someone closed the other "rage" thread, where I wanted to post it. The thing about forum rage is: it is so tempting, but it only vents our anger for a brief time; and that anger is usually just frustration. This is much better! We hear more about concerns here, and I find that I can understand other people's position better. Dayz could be made a textbook example of how a conversion mod-game is more problematic than starting from scratch. The reasons Dayz went into Alpha-funding are probably varied: to stay ahead of the (free) mod competition, to release a new standalone game, to use the hype to get funded...

 

Let me stop you there.

DayZ is not a crowd funded title, and it never has been. You're thinking of kickstarter titles.

DayZ is not dependent on sales from Early Access to fund itself, and it never has been.

[Hicks_206 (DayZ) 4297]

3 hours ago, Tigermonk said:

like s3v3n explains in the thread above. let's hope april is the new beginning for us all... including the devs.. put some renewed fire in the work ethic. so in turn.. we'll hopefully have more results and a little less 'we think/maybe' that would do a lot of people in the community very good including myself :) no more 'long' term lists that end up with 8-10 months delay.. because it's 'written' thus visible to everything and everyone. just a solid stream of step by step, point by point progress that we can all enjoy ;)

And don't let me catch you putting the work ethic of the developers in question again, Tigermonk. 

[ColdAtrophy 1850]

Not to kiss ass or anything, but I'm gonna have to side with Hicks here. Looks like they just pushed another internal debug build an hour ago. https://steamdb.info/app/221100/history/

Slackers don't generally work this late on a Saturday night/Sunday evening for a 9-5 Monday thru Friday job.

Edited March 27, 2016 by ColdAtrophy

[S3V3N 1402]

13 hours ago, Hicks_206 (DayZ) said:

Let me stop you there.

DayZ is not a crowd funded title, and it never has been. You're thinking of kickstarter titles.

DayZ is not dependent on sales from Early Access to fund itself, and it never has been.

Dayz does have a budget, right? And it is in early funding. And it is an Alpha. Disregardless of how you want to call it, this is Prototype-Funding. Though admittedly, Bohemia didn't have to go this way. They had the funds to do a closed development. Yet, they decided this was good idea for all of us. And now here we sit each month, justifying to each other yet another delay. No, Dayz is not a slacker team - because slackers effectively work as little as possible to avoid any stress. Dayz devs work a hell of a lot too much for the kind of stress they get. Obviously, mistakes were made in the past and all we're asking for is that there'll be a change in strategy and information after the renderer-update. Things were announced, now they just need to happen.

[sneakydude 480]

4 hours ago, ColdAtrophy said:

Not to kiss ass or anything, but I'm gonna have to side with Hicks here. Looks like they just pushed another internal debug build an hour ago. https://steamdb.info/app/221100/history/

Slackers don't generally work this late on a Saturday night/Sunday evening for a 9-5 Monday thru Friday job.

OH you kiss ass!! :)

[Tigermonk 140]

3 hours ago, S3V3N said:

Dayz does have a budget, right? And it is in early funding. And it is an Alpha. Disregardless of how you want to call it, this is Prototype-Funding. Though admittedly, Bohemia didn't have to go this way. They had the funds to do a closed development. Yet, they decided this was good idea for all of us. And now here we sit each month, justifying to each other yet another delay. No, Dayz is not a slacker team - because slackers effectively work as little as possible to avoid any stress. Dayz devs work a hell of a lot too much for the kind of stress they get. Obviously, mistakes were made in the past and all we're asking for is that there'll be a change in strategy and information after the renderer-update. Things were announced, now they just need to happen.

 

18 hours ago, Hicks_206 (DayZ) said:

And don't let me catch you putting the work ethic of the developers in question again, Tigermonk. 

as you can see mr hicks... I wasn't putting the devs worth ethic in question... i was mearly stating almost the same as s3v3n once again did in this quote. mistakes were made in the past and all we're asking for is that there'll be a change in strategy and information after the renderer-update. Things were announced, now they just need to happen.

you guys posted the 'to-do list' for 2015 half of that list was not (yet) completed.. that was the only thing I was stating.. and I'll just copy/past my own comment here again to clarify
('let's hope april is the new beginning for us all... including the devs.. put some renewed fire in the work ethic. so in turn.. we'll hopefully have more results and a little less 'we think/maybe')

you guys have used the word HOPE a lot over the last couple of months.. so.. 'we HOPE april brings new energy and more effecient work ethic to you guys.. so things run smoother.. less bugs... quicker updates in the process.

thats all I'm saying.. I never said you guys didn't work hard... because you do.. but due to circumstances your scheduled plan has been blown to bits over time.
so april/spring seems like the perfect time for a good catch up race.. warmer weather.. more positive mindsets because of better weather... win-win 

[sneakydude 480]

For all those that forget. Right or wrong, you still agree to this statement.

 

WARNING: THIS GAME IS EARLY ACCESS ALPHA. PLEASE DO NOT PURCHASE IT UNLESS YOU WANT TO ACTIVELY SUPPORT DEVELOPMENT OF THE GAME AND ARE PREPARED TO HANDLE WITH SERIOUS ISSUES AND POSSIBLE INTERRUPTIONS OF GAME FUNCTIONING.